New Rider
Currently Offline
Posts: 39 
Likes: 6
Joined: Jul 12, 2015 18:48:02 GMT -5
|
Post by shantyhag on Jul 13, 2015 21:08:24 GMT -5
OK, so I'm going to 'fess-up that I'm a complete and total newb when it comes to scooter mechanics. I got around on a bush-bike-- basically a Honda scoot with an upgraded suspension-- when I lived in West Africa, and that was a constant maintenance battle but I had the help of some incredibly intelligent and talented people and was mostly responsible for paying for the parts to keep it running. Now, my wife and I are opening a used car dealership. We find we have some space inside and we've always had a thing for sexy scooters; we're going to devote the inside space to selling new ones... assuming that BMS agrees then it will almost certainly be their bikes we start with. What we want to do is to find a way to differentiate ourselves from the internet guys. We are in an area with several colleges, where scooters can be ridden almost every day year round. We'll be able to provide financing, even some after-market F&I products like warranties and roadside assistance. But, man, it looks like the cream of the crop provide some great PDI work. We want to be those people. So, I'm looking at the stuff that can really make a difference. It would appear that BMS is already using good belts (I get this from the photos in one of the posts of the Heritage 150 where it appears their using Bando stock). So that's nice, yes? An iridium plug can make a difference, yes? Also, I've looked at CDI and Ignition Coils, which a lot of you seem to recommend replacing right away. Here's one that I found that wouldn't break the bank to upgrade with at PDI, but would it make a difference or does anyone have any better ideas?: www.everestpartssupplies.com/products/gy6-50cc-125cc-150cc-scooter-racing-performance-cdi-ignition-coil-atv-mopedYou're all very smart people, so I suspect you get the idea... I'm looking for things that a reasonably capable person can do prior to delivery to improve the quality of the bike and build value in the mind of the customer without adding an overwhelming amount to either the bottom or top lines of the sales price. We don't want to be a discount shop; we do want to sell scooters. Thanks in advance, all. Shantyhag |
|
New Rider
Currently Offline
Posts: 39
Likes: 6
Joined: Jul 12, 2015 18:48:02 GMT -5
|
Post by shantyhag on Jul 13, 2015 21:56:43 GMT -5
Let me apologize... I tried to use the linking function, but apparently I'm inept. I've added a direct link to the CDI and Ignition Coil upgrade page.
|
|
|
|
Post by geh3333 on Jul 13, 2015 22:43:28 GMT -5
How's it going ? The CVT is the cheapest , easiest way to up the scoots performance. The coil , cdi , and plug are good upgrades but you will not get much out of them when it comes to increase speed or torque. Light roller weights and slightly stronger clutch springs will help with takeoff and top end. Just don't go too light on the weights. You want to be able to hit near 7500 rpms on a straight run to be able to take full advantage of the scoots power. Down long hills you don't want to be able to exceed 8000 rpms. It can be time consuming getting the CVT tuned properly , but its worth it. Next I would do a carb and exhaust mod. A bigger carb and a high flow exhaust will do wonders. With these mods you should have no problem hitting 60+ " that's real mph , not going by the speedo , which are usually off on these scoots " . when I say bigger carb, I would go with a 26mm if keeping the stock bore. Maybe upjet to a 115-120 main jet.
|
|
|
|
Post by rcq92130 on Jul 13, 2015 23:09:58 GMT -5
Since I've doubled the original cost of my BMS Heritage in changes and upgrades, I might be able to shed light.
1. Comes with a Bando belt, as you said. Chage it out for a kevlar belt. You can sell the Bandos on EBay
2. Go to tvnacman's site and get advancing angle CDIs (NOT advancED agngle CDIs, which will trash the starter gearing).
3. Hardware is all stainless, so that's OK
4. Stock real tires. I got 2,000 miles off my first rear tire
5. Check with geh for headlight upgrades. The chinaBulb that comes with these things is an actual road hazard at night. These upgrades are cheap but wonderful. Also thinik aboud adding an LED tail strip. Mine was pretty much invisible from the rear at night with the OEM 0.00000001 watt tail/stop bulb.
6. Stock a full range of performance upgrades so your customers are not forced to cultivate internet suppliers. GEH can give you a list, but they include 1. Uni filter & air tube; 2. Bigger carb & intake manifold 3. Exhaust that is not intended for a lawn mower 4. variators & sliders 5. clutches, though i think most customers get to this after the other mods 6. shocks
7. Think of addons to the initial sale to suit customers' tastes. I have air horns, radio, tach, a row of on/off switches, manual choke, electric fuel pump, an LED strip on the trunk for better stop lighting, flashers for headlight & stop light. I think you will be able to talk customers into at least some of these at the time of initial sale as they are safety issues (you want to be seen & heard so you don't end up a pancake).
8. At least get a good supplier lined up for BBKs and a mechanic to install them for your customers. Again, GEH has the name of a very good supplier of Taiwan product at a very good price, 2 day free delivery.
9. Though it may seem early, think downstream and understand your customers WILL want to upgrade after a few years. Don't force them to go elsewhere. Think about a migration strategy yourself so in a few years you are ready with larger or better machines (Honda, etc.).
Hope this helps. You didn;t say where you will start this company.
|
|
New Rider
Currently Offline
Posts: 39
Likes: 6
Joined: Jul 12, 2015 18:48:02 GMT -5
|
Post by shantyhag on Jul 14, 2015 16:23:08 GMT -5
Thank you both, GEH and RCQ! RCQ, we're actually not very far from you... if your name is also your zip code, we live just over the 5 from you (though the shop will be closer to town... I'll let you know more when we have things a little better locked down).
GEH... my concern-- and it sounds like you know a great deal more than do I about such things, no question-- but my concern is that aside from being beyond my personal skill level at the moment, that making changes to the CVT would void the factory warranty. It sounds like something that would be fun to learn how to do, but that might diminish the perceived value of the bike because the warranty would no longer apply. Is this a safe assumption or am I totally out in left field?
RCQ-- did you by any chance post a video of your LED lights? I saw a video of LED lights on the back of I believe a Heritage 150. They were pretty! Made a huge difference in the visibility of the bike, lit up the sky like a Harley tail. As far as thinking ahead, we have been doing so. We looked at Yamaha, but man that's a major commitment we're not yet able to make. They want a ton of space and a lot of inventory on the lot... I would too if I could command such a market. The list you made is great, though, and it made my wife and I start looking around at our little place to figure out exactly where "Parts" are going to go. (I'm assuming, btw, that BBK is a bore kit, yes? I've seen that acronym used here several times and I was guessing from context).
Thank you, again!
Shantyhag
|
|
|
|
Post by rcq92130 on Jul 14, 2015 19:52:47 GMT -5
Thank you both, GEH and RCQ! RCQ, we're actually not very far from you... if your name is also your zip code, we live just over the 5 from you (though the shop will be closer to town... I'll let you know more when we have things a little better locked down). GEH... my concern-- and it sounds like you know a great deal more than do I about such things, no question-- but my concern is that aside from being beyond my personal skill level at the moment, that making changes to the CVT would void the factory warranty. It sounds like something that would be fun to learn how to do, but that might diminish the perceived value of the bike because the warranty would no longer apply. Is this a safe assumption or am I totally out in left field? RCQ-- did you by any chance post a video of your LED lights? I saw a video of LED lights on the back of I believe a Heritage 150. They were pretty! Made a huge difference in the visibility of the bike, lit up the sky like a Harley tail. As far as thinking ahead, we have been doing so. We looked at Yamaha, but man that's a major commitment we're not yet able to make. They want a ton of space and a lot of inventory on the lot... I would too if I could command such a market. The list you made is great, though, and it made my wife and I start looking around at our little place to figure out exactly where "Parts" are going to go. (I'm assuming, btw, that BBK is a bore kit, yes? I've seen that acronym used here several times and I was guessing from context). Thank you, again! Shantyhag 1. Yep. Del mar 2. Have not yet posted an LED video, but will do so (for another person also). Important beyond anything else to be visible and heard. 3. ChinaWarranty is only  days. Not exactly a big deal. It will be 6 months or so before your customers want to monkey around (other than "spruce up" things like lights & air horns) 4. There is no legitimate ChinaLawnMowerScooter dealer or repair station north of San Diego. Big market need. Motorcycle repair places like FBC and small independants don't want to mes with our chinaLawnMowerScooters. 5. Didn't mean to start in with Honda or Yamahahahaha right now - just think ahead so you have an evolution strategy from day 1. Biggest mistake anyone makes is to not grow with your customers. 6. you REALLY need to track down a good mechanic. GEH is insane living in rural Pennsylvania - get him to move out to where there is no snow. 7. BBK is Big Bore Kit. Pretty much everyone who gets a 50cc or 150cc chinaLawnMower wants a bigger piston. The supplier I use is in Puerto Rico (Taiwan manufactured parts - much higher quality than china factories) and much lower prices than in the mainland. Shipping is free - almost always is only 2 days from order to package on doorstep. Great place. With delivery that fast you can avoid investing in inventory and save cash. Here is their Ebay adv: www.ebay.com/sch/m.html?_odkw=spring&_ssn=gy6racingteam&hash=item2c96128766&item=191496357734&pt=Motorcycles_Parts_Accessories&_osacat=0&vxp=mtr&_from=R40&_trksid=p2046732.m570.l1313.TR0.TRC2.A0.H0.X.TRS5&_nkw=&_sacat=0 Welcome! |
|
|
|
Post by toddmaples on Jul 15, 2015 5:58:57 GMT -5
Thank you both, GEH and RCQ! RCQ, we're actually not very far from you... if your name is also your zip code, we live just over the 5 from you (though the shop will be closer to town... I'll let you know more when we have things a little better locked down). GEH... my concern-- and it sounds like you know a great deal more than do I about such things, no question-- but my concern is that aside from being beyond my personal skill level at the moment, that making changes to the CVT would void the factory warranty. It sounds like something that would be fun to learn how to do, but that might diminish the perceived value of the bike because the warranty would no longer apply. Is this a safe assumption or am I totally out in left field? RCQ-- did you by any chance post a video of your LED lights? I saw a video of LED lights on the back of I believe a Heritage 150. They were pretty! Made a huge difference in the visibility of the bike, lit up the sky like a Harley tail. As far as thinking ahead, we have been doing so. We looked at Yamaha, but man that's a major commitment we're not yet able to make. They want a ton of space and a lot of inventory on the lot... I would too if I could command such a market. The list you made is great, though, and it made my wife and I start looking around at our little place to figure out exactly where "Parts" are going to go. (I'm assuming, btw, that BBK is a bore kit, yes? I've seen that acronym used here several times and I was guessing from context). Thank you, again! Shantyhag 1. Yep. Del mar 2. Have not yet posted an LED video, but will do so (for another person also). Important beyond anything else to be visible and heard. 3. ChinaWarranty is only days. Not exactly a big deal. It will be 6 months or so before your customers want to monkey around (other than "spruce up" things like lights & air horns) 4. There is no legitimate ChinaLawnMowerScooter dealer or repair station north of San Diego. Big market need. Motorcycle repair places like FBC and small independants don't want to mes with our chinaLawnMowerScooters. 5. Didn't mean to start in with Honda or Yamahahahaha right now - just think ahead so you have an evolution strategy from day 1. Biggest mistake anyone makes is to not grow with your customers. 6. you REALLY need to track down a good mechanic. GEH is insane living in rural Pennsylvania - get him to move out to where there is no snow. 7. BBK is Big Bore Kit. Pretty much everyone who gets a 50cc or 150cc chinaLawnMower wants a bigger piston. The supplier I use is in Puerto Rico (Taiwan manufactured parts - much higher quality than china factories) and much lower prices than in the mainland. Shipping is free - almost always is only 2 days from order to package on doorstep. Great place. With delivery that fast you can avoid investing in inventory and save cash. Here is their Ebay adv: www.ebay.com/sch/m.html?_odkw=spring&_ssn=gy6racingteam&hash=item2c96128766&item=191496357734&pt=Motorcycles_Parts_Accessories&_osacat=0&vxp=mtr&_from=R40&_trksid=p2046732.m570.l1313.TR0.TRC2.A0.H0.X.TRS5&_nkw=&_sacat=0 Welcome! For the right compensation i could possibly be convinced to move back to SoCal... I also work on cars, and industrial machinery. |
|
New Rider
Currently Offline
Posts: 39
Likes: 6
Joined: Jul 12, 2015 18:48:02 GMT -5
|
Post by shantyhag on Jul 15, 2015 11:57:41 GMT -5
Thanks again, RCQ! Here's the video I saw of the LED taillights: We totally agree with you about really good mechanic. Not sure that 'part-time to start scooter mechanic' pays well enough for a cross-country move, but George, if you're interested... As to warranty, one of the reasons we're so adamant about having a great mechanic is that BMS actually offers a full year parts and labor warranty and requires dealers to be able to service any/all bikes under warranty whether they bought them from us or not. Their reimbursement rates for the labor is REALLY low, however. I also see all over that the guys doing online sales are in violation of that dealer clause by offering only parts, or selling the 'extended warranty' for up to 12 months. We do plan on offering F&I products like extended warranties, but they would be good for time and things not covered under factory warranty which, while not as good as Sym/Lance, is I believe comparable to Piaggio/Yamaha/etc. It almost seems like the distributor is trying to do the right thing but is being hamstrung by a non-compliant dealer network. Also, their reimbursement is in credit not in cash, which makes for a less-than-profitable service side. Here's a link to their reimbursement rate page if you're interested: www.bmsmotor.com/warranty/flat_rate.htmlAm I wrong in thinking that's really low? |
|
New Rider
Currently Offline
Posts: 39
Likes: 6
Joined: Jul 12, 2015 18:48:02 GMT -5
|
Post by shantyhag on Jul 15, 2015 12:01:48 GMT -5
LOL. Thanks, Todd... something to keep in mind! Where are you now?
|
|
|
|
Post by ghcoe on Jul 15, 2015 17:47:01 GMT -5
Looks like just labor rate, not shop rate. If I had to replace a cylinder I would charge for carb, intake, head, replacement too. You have to remove them to get to the cylinder and then have to replace them......Just saying! |
|
|
|
Post by rcq92130 on Jul 15, 2015 18:36:29 GMT -5
Thanks again, RCQ! Here's the video I saw of the LED taillights: We totally agree with you about really good mechanic. Not sure that 'part-time to start scooter mechanic' pays well enough for a cross-country move, but George, if you're interested... As to warranty, one of the reasons we're so adamant about having a great mechanic is that BMS actually offers a full year parts and labor warranty and requires dealers to be able to service any/all bikes under warranty whether they bought them from us or not. Their reimbursement rates for the labor is REALLY low, however. I also see all over that the guys doing online sales are in violation of that dealer clause by offering only parts, or selling the 'extended warranty' for up to 12 months. We do plan on offering F&I products like extended warranties, but they would be good for time and things not covered under factory warranty which, while not as good as Sym/Lance, is I believe comparable to Piaggio/Yamaha/etc. It almost seems like the distributor is trying to do the right thing but is being hamstrung by a non-compliant dealer network. Also, their reimbursement is in credit not in cash, which makes for a less-than-profitable service side. Here's a link to their reimbursement rate page if you're interested: www.bmsmotor.com/warranty/flat_rate.htmlAm I wrong in thinking that's really low? Interesting video. That guy has TWO LED strip lights - one to augment the tail light (always on) and one to augment the brake light. His upper strip (along the trunk) looks like it's the same kind of thing I did. I don't know how/where he put the lower strip (brake) - on my Heritage i couldn't find a very good place down there, near the bumper. I'll try to get a video of mine for ya. Interesting that BMW has a 12 month warranty. I bought mine online (company in Texas) and they said it was only a 3 month warranty. So, with a full year your concerns about parts breaking and you losing money having to replace them makes much more sense. The reimbursement rates they offer are a total joke. Maybe those rates would work for work done IN CHINA .... not here. Better than zero though. As a sales pitch for new customer sales I'd emphasize the PDI and that it must be done by prof. tech. for the warranty to be valid. online retailers of course don't do this (generally). The target market for scooters around here (iI think) is younger people, so maybe you can get a college student to work part time as your mechanic - someone who has a scooter himself. I was confused by BMS dealer terms - do they require 2 units a month or 6 a month (saw both these listed in different places). R U looking for places in Sorrento Valley? To me that would make a lot of sense. |
|
|
|
Post by rcq92130 on Jul 15, 2015 22:47:47 GMT -5
If this works, I should be able to show you three short videos: 1. Here is the LED BRAKE LIGHT I added: View My VideoAs you can see, I have a flasher unit that greatly enhances the brake light effect. Flashes for a bit then goes solid light a regular brake light. The flasher is a cheap $20 part from EBay (I added a relay just in case I'm drawing too much power because I have a more powerful incandescent bulb in the standard brake light socket). I also added a short LED strip ABOVE the taillight that just augments the normal taillight (not the stp light). Here is a pic showing where the LED stop and tail lights are:  2. Flashing driving light: View My VideoThis is a daytime flasher so you are visible to other cars. It's a 64-chip LED behind a flasher unit. The light output from this (if it was on steady) is WAAAYY not enough for nighttime driving, but it's eprfect for a daytime flasher and draws almost no electrical current. 3. Headlight flasher: I have a very bright H4 bulb in where the puny little ChinaBulb normally sits that is a wonderful upgrade for nighttime driving - very bright! But it draws a good deal of current, so I only use it at night. In addition, I added a high-current flasher that can handle the current of the H$ bulb so I can, if i want, run the H4 in flashing mode instead of the LED driving light. It's much brighter: View My VideoThese are all safety features you should be able to sell to new scooter buyers. 4. The other SAFETY FEATURE i recommend is a LOUD horn like these air horns, available on EBay and elsewhere:  5. It's probably a tougher time-of-purchase upsell to get your customer to buy a tach, but they really are essential for anyone who upgrades the engine or carb and needs to tune. I actually have 2 (one analog and one digital - bottom left and right corners of this cluster) "just because". The digital one is useless during the day while driving (can't see the readout).  These things are all good profit margin items for you (or should be) and can easily double what you keep from the sale of a scooter - and they should be pretty easy things to convince most customers about at the time of sale (if they have cash). The safety features are so the rider is not killed - kind of an easy sell; much easier for a new scooter buyer to go for than an engine or CDI upgrade (which they will come back for, but after 6 mos or a year). Hope this is of some interest. |
|
New Rider
Currently Offline
Posts: 39
Likes: 6
Joined: Jul 12, 2015 18:48:02 GMT -5
|
Post by shantyhag on Jul 15, 2015 23:29:01 GMT -5
As a sales pitch for new customer sales I'd emphasize the PDI and that it must be done by prof. tech. for the warranty to be valid. online retailers of course don't do this (generally)...
I was confused by BMS dealer terms - do they require 2 units a month or 6 a month (saw both these listed in different places). First of these, absolutely agreed... this was why I started the thread: "Not Only Do We Provide Service After the Sale, Here's What We Do BEFORE the Sale..." Second, I was confused by this as well, but I believe that the 6 units guarantees the territory. My fear isn't being able to hit 6 units per month, but being able to deliver the product people want. Personally, I can't wait to ride the TBX-260 in orange, but they only have burgundy in stock right now. So, our space is actually in renovation right now. We can't get our dealer's license until after we can put a desk, a phone and a sign inside to prove that we have a location-- the entire process seems 'cart before the horse'. We have our location, are already paying rent. It's about 15 minutes from your door (or at least ours) in Del Mar to the office at 8am. It's sometimes worse at 5pm, which makes no sense to me, but it's west of the 5. It would appear that the only dealer that had China Scoots close (well, unless you count Lance and the guys in Hillcrest don't) closed because of exceptionally bad service, or exceptionally bad business. I think that they were probably related. The only reason, RCQ, that I'm being coy at all about that right now is that 2 v 6 units. I don't want to raise any flags and not get the chance to sell the franchise. When we talked to the rep from Sym he tried to talk me into moving to Madison, WI to open a dealership. We just got to San Diego and we really want to stay awhile. |
|
New Rider
Currently Offline
Posts: 39
Likes: 6
Joined: Jul 12, 2015 18:48:02 GMT -5
|
Post by shantyhag on Jul 15, 2015 23:31:25 GMT -5
]Looks like just labor rate, not shop rate. If I had to replace a cylinder I would charge for carb, intake, head, replacement too. You have to remove them to get to the cylinder and then have to replace them......Just saying! GHCoe, you're absolute right, but I'm pretty sure that's not the way it works. The customer doesn't have to pay anything to get the warranty work done, and the distributor only gives credit for the job performed. |
|
New Rider
Currently Offline
Posts: 39
Likes: 6
Joined: Jul 12, 2015 18:48:02 GMT -5
|
Post by shantyhag on Jul 15, 2015 23:51:26 GMT -5
These things are all good profit margin items for you (or should be) and can easily double what you keep from the sale of a scooter - and they should be pretty easy things to convince most customers about at the time of sale (if they have cash). What's cool about being able to offer financing is that the lender will typically allow for "hard adds." The upsells you're talking about are easier when they finance because they don't cost a whole lot, but add real value to the bike and the banks will allow them in the loan. I was really surprised that the tach wasn't included in the Heritage cluster. It is on the 260, I'm almost positive. Your lights look GREAT! I was looking at an aftermarket trunk that had lights built in earlier. T'was on eBay, I'm pretty sure. I'll look in a little while and see if I can't find the link. |
|
days. Not exactly a big deal. It will be 6 months or so before your customers want to monkey around (other than "spruce up" things like lights & air horns)
