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Post by gy6girl on Mar 25, 2013 18:36:40 GMT -5
I read through the PDF's of the CVT.
Everything there, I get, and kind of already knew.
What it didn't say, and what I am trying to wrap my head around, is the clutch springs.
So stronger the springs, the more rpms it will take to open them up, thus allowing the clutch pulley to open up.
The weaker they are, the less rpms it has to have for the pulley to open up.
But, it's also pushing against the contra spring, so that will effect how the clutch pulley opens.
How is the best way to work this out?
The contra spring is all about pushing the pulleys back together.
So.. my guess.. and please correct me if I am wrong...
If I put a heavy contra spring on, but light clutch springs, that would mean the clutch springs would open at low rpms allowing it the pulleys to open as much as easily as it can with a heavy contra spring.
Now, wouldn't that just equal things out?
Would you ever want to go light clutch springs, heavy contra spring, or the other way around?
Wouldn't it be best to do the same sizes as clutch and contra springs?
Please discuss...
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Post by scootercapecod on Mar 25, 2013 19:09:01 GMT -5
usually, you want to keep the contra spring matched up with the clutch springs, so for instance Red with Red, Yellow with Yellow etc..... Meaning that there's a consistent match with the clutch engaging at the exact RPM you want it to. That said, you can mix and match but that requires playing around with the roller weights to get the exact result you're looking for. It can be confusing, you either can use the front end of the CVT (the variator and the roller weights) or the back end (the clutch, springs or transmission gears). It all depends on your desired result.
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Post by tvnacman on Mar 25, 2013 19:32:32 GMT -5
the answer lies in your goal . a heavy contra spring will cause the the clutch pulley to open slowly (holding the low gear longer ) the lighter clutch springs will allow your clutch to engage at lower rpm . Remember the lower rpm clutch springs will act like an engine brake on decell .
Share with us what your looking for .
John
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Post by millsc on Mar 25, 2013 19:48:57 GMT -5
I have a 1.5k torque spring and a 1k clutch springs I didn't like the other stiffer clutch springs. Just got try different ones and see what you like best the 1.5 torque spring seems to hold good rpm on hills for me. I could of kept the stock clutch springs and would of been fine
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Post by jeffery5568 on Mar 25, 2013 19:53:18 GMT -5
Clutch springs effect when your clutch engages letting you take off at a higher rpm. The contra spring effects how hard it is to open the back pulley the stiffer the spring the higher the rpms have to be to make the CVT "shift" this is also controlled with the weights of the rollers. Its very simple how it all works its just hard to explain over a message.
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Post by millsc on Mar 25, 2013 20:05:24 GMT -5
anyone use a 2k torque spring? If so how you even get the belt on, i have to take the clutch off to replace the belt thats with the 1.5k torque spring
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Post by alleyoop on Mar 25, 2013 20:11:51 GMT -5
Millsc, Use Channel Lock Pliers works great and only with one hand to squeeze the pulley back. Alleyoop  |
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Post by millsc on Mar 25, 2013 20:13:12 GMT -5
Thanks will try that i can do i by hand but it hard as and i have a great grip
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Post by tvnacman on Mar 25, 2013 20:18:17 GMT -5
Thanks will try that i can do i by hand but it hard as and i have a great grip we won't ask why lol John |
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Post by alleyoop on Mar 25, 2013 20:18:24 GMT -5
Yea give it a try I use it and it sure saves your hands and fingers.
Alleyoop
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Post by woowilly on Mar 25, 2013 23:02:06 GMT -5
Looks like there's lots of misinformation. the clutch springs holding the shoes only control what rpm you start to move at.( and the rpm the clutch disengages when slowing down.) weak springs engage at low rpm and you take off slow at first from a stop when throttle slammed open. ( real user friendly, and can cruise at a real slow speed. )
Stiffer springs allow the engine to rev higher before engaging, with wheelies, tire spin, faster take off from a stop and other fun when the throttle is slammed open.
( they're not for people who want to go putting around slow...)
The contra spring ( or torque spring ) in conjuction with the variator weights determine pulley gear ratio at a given rpm. any contra spring can be made to act similar to any other with the appropriate variactor weights and vice versa.
( to do so however, the heavier rollers wouldn't fit physically, and the lightest would have durability problems from being so thin. )
There is only a limited selection of contra springs with drastically different spring rates because that's the coarse adjustment, and variactor weights are in fine steps in weight to fine tune it with. The extreems in variactor weight choices overlap the opposing extreems when you go up or down with the contra spring stiffness choice.
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Post by woowilly on Mar 25, 2013 23:34:15 GMT -5
Something else, I just remembered:
a light contra spring with light roller will be more affected by engine torque when in mid to upper ranges on the pulleys and you roll open the throttle, it'll effectively downshift and let the rpms come up a bit. ( better for underpowered small engines, and fun rolling wheelies on bigger engines .) This setup has light belt tension. watch for a belt slippage problems
A heavy contra spring with heavy rollers is less affected by engine torque and is more user friendly on bigger engines and gives more sluggish performance on underpowered engines. This setup has higher belt tension and belt wear from the tension.
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Post by alleyoop on Mar 25, 2013 23:50:06 GMT -5
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Post by xxwoodmanxx on Mar 26, 2013 4:40:57 GMT -5
anyone use a 2k torque spring? If so how you even get the belt on, i have to take the clutch off to replace the belt thats with the 1.5k torque spring IF you're careful, you can do like I did, and set up 2 or 3 pistol-grip style clamps. So long as you compress them evenly nd slowly, it works out just fine |
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Post by gy6girl on Mar 26, 2013 13:09:58 GMT -5
Thanks.. I think I can wrap my head around it now. I think I see where I was looking at it wrong. I thought the clutch springs had something to do with how the pulley opens up, which it doesn't. That's what was messing me up. I was wondering how in the world do you decide on the right springs when both sets of springs are doing the same thing? The answer.. they are not. So let me get this straight... The contra spring is what controls how much force it takes to open the clutch pulleys. The clutch springs control on how much force it takes to engage the pulley to the back wheel. See, I always thought the variator was what acted like a clutch, which it does, but it's not alone. The clutch pulley and springs do the same thing. Got it! Why would you not want the lowest clutch springs possible? What good would it do to have to have higher rpms just to engage the wheel? Especially when the variator works as a type of clutch itself. |
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..BAD TO THE BONE..
