USA, large displacement rides.  By  dollartwentyfive (Read 6,441 times)

Preparation and maintenance are key elements.

The Piaggio 250 have a 12,500 mile belt along with a pretty good cooling and filtration system on the CVT however its sad how many do not clean the filter and end up killing a new belt on the first long ride. On a 2 week vacation I have put multiple 600 mile days in totalling well over 4,000 miles traveled without incident however that was preceded by an early belt/roller change along with oil/gear lube change, new engine air and CVT filters and checking/cleaning the CVT filter every 2,000 miles (more often on dusty roads). Many times the entire 600 mile day would be at 80 mph Interstate speeds so I know that a well maintained stock Piaggio 250 is fully capable of standing up to a 3,000 mile ride with very little maintenance during the event if everything was brought up to date before leaving the starting gate. You will only go through 1/3 of the tire life, 1/2 the distance between oil changes and 1/4 the distance between belt changes on engines with a 100,000 + mile life expectancy on these bikes in 3,000 miles so a well maintained and prepped one should only leave the rider and his abilities being tested.

Personally I go with Engine Ice for coolant since its non-toxic and works out very well on our 115 degree roadways. Preparation to switch over is a simple flush with white vinegar. You see a very definite reduction in the time between when the cooling fan comes on and it cycles off making it so that engine temperatures stay more even.

I know some of the previous years contestants that were riding the Vespa 250's thrashing out where they went wrong together with them afterwards and for most it was experimental enhancements that they thought would give them an edge backfiring on them. Some for example switched to oversized sliders to get higher top end speeds without taking precautions against over riding the edge of the drive face and snagging the oil sump gasket resulting in zero mile days while they corrected the damage from the failed experiment which pulled the gasket from the top of the oil sump dumping all their oil and destroying the belt. While for others it was simply lack of preparation, switching to an aftermarket belt and/or failure to keep the CVT filter clean. Sometimes the big issue was in choosing the wrong riding pants/base layers causing so much discomfort (thick seams and elastic leg bands that cut circulation or pinch the sciatic nerve) that riding was almost impossible.

The Cannon Ball is not the best time to test out new mods that may backfire on you thats for sure and not the best place for a high mileage poorly maintained bike or new relatively low mileage rider.

The only ones I have heard of are on those where they removed the very reliable OEM variator and replaced it with a Polini. The aftermarket performance variators too often in order to shave weight thin out the ramp plates so that they shatter under the tourque of the high compression 244 engine messing up the splines on the crank. We have found that shifting to sliders and adding a 1 mm machined washer between the outer drive face and the center boss gives a better boost in performance without the failures associated with those less durable aftermarket parts. Trim the excess off the oil sump gasket while your at it to prevent it from being grabbed by the ribs on the back of the belt.

Belt failures are most often from failure to clean the CVT filter then the aftermarket or old belts being used. See that all the time but most don't like to admit that they simply pushed things too far. Lets face it, 12,500 miles from a rubber V Belt squeezed in a variator drive is plenty yet too many push for 15,000 miles and don't make it.

You keep them stock and they are Honda reliable but give you much higher levels of performance per cc.

About 6 maybe more years ago I can't remember if it was Motorbike Magazine or not however they entered several of their senior editors in a Sport bike race but did not tell them until the last minute and shocked them by giving them Aprilia 460, Vespa 300, Suzuki 650, Yamaha and Honda Silverwing large scooters as their race bikes at the last moment when it was too late. One took a place (can't remember if it was the T-Max or Burgman 650) and the rest all finished in the top 20% of the field comprised of 650 and 750cc Sport Bikes. The riders in the bottom 80% really hated the scooters that were out in front of them at the end of the race. They were no longer making fun of the magazine editors riding Scooters in a Sport Bike Race. I really wish I hade saved the printed copy of that article as it was really precious.

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My point exactly,,, the winners of the cannonball are very well prepped and setup,, and most importantly maintain fastidiously

We have riders running from the Vespa GT200 up to the Scarabeo 500 from Clearwater to as far as Prudhoe Bay in Northern Alaska and back with very few issues. Some are touring regularly from New York to Miami on the Aprilia Atlantic 500 with little to no drama at all after working through the teething pains of taking a seldom used 14 year old scooter and putting it back in service after sitting all that time as someone else's garage ornament.

CVT drive does not automatically mean unreliable. I ran production lines on CVT drives 2 and 3 shifts a day 6 days a week with very few belt failures. My 1952 FMC farm tractor is CVT drive and is extremely reliable pulling ground engaging attachments such as coulters, moldboard plows, rakes sets, etc. Many riding lawn mowers today are still CVT driven too and holding up very well in commercial service with many wearing out the engines before the drive belts. Its true that many have machined steel drive faces however not all and the high grade aluminum alloys are holding up almost as good as the steel.

I can honestly say that I know more riders who have had a catastrophic near fatal motorcycle chain failure than those who've had scooter CVT drive belt failures.

i haven't had a belt failure on my ride, even after 10,000 miles.
the OEM was starting to show signs of failure at around 7,000 miles (pieces were starting to flake off the outer surface) but i replaced it before it failed.
there seems to be some kind of fabric interwoven with steel strands on the outside of the belt covered with a layer of rubber, and this fabric started to shred.
these steel strands breaking is what probably destroys most belts when they fail.
i would imagine a kevlar belt would outlast a "steel/fabric" belt under the same conditions.
these steel strands is probably responsible for the "grooves" in the variator.

i blame the particular design of my CVT case for the above because there wasn't enough clearance between the case and the variator.
the belt rode so high in the pulleys it (the case) shaved off one edge of the belt which led to the steel fabric breaking.

the OEM belt was the 1000mm outside circumference

"A good rider can make do with whatever they have on hand." -w650
That statement sums up my take-away from this excellent, long, spirited thread.