Freshman Rider
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Riding something with two wheels and an engine for 40 some years.
Posts: 81 
Likes: 4
Joined: Apr 2, 2016 7:11:13 GMT -5
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Post by powerzombie on Apr 5, 2016 19:36:09 GMT -5
I just use rotella 15w-40. I've heard it's better with high heat since it's made for diesels which sounds reasonable, no idea if it's true or not lol, but I'd like to think so. It's cheap at least and seems to do the job. I use that in my Suzuki, since it's compatible with a wet clutch. (it doesn't have an 'energy conserving' rating). It also has a lot of zinc, like Quaker State Defy. That's a good thing for flat tappet and air cooled engines. |
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Post by mikestib1 on Apr 15, 2016 19:22:31 GMT -5
Scooter motors spend a lot of time at high rpm. They are no lawn mower engines. You can buy a gallon of 5w40 synthetic shell rotella t6 for $22. Kymco recommend full synthetic. Genuine recommends full synthetic for their 2 strokes. Since both of these companies provide 2 year warranties I would bet synthetic oil provides better protection at start up and continuos high rpm use. No dollar store oil for me. My scooter only takes about .75 lt. Dino oil today has all kinds of additives but even modern cars are needing semi or full synthetic if you expect the manufacturer to foot the bill for the engine while its under warranty. After the first oil change its synthetic for me
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Post by rockynv on Apr 16, 2016 0:40:28 GMT -5
Scooter motors spend a lot of time at high rpm. They are no lawn mower engines. You can buy a gallon of 5w40 synthetic shell rotella t6 for $22. Kymco recommend full synthetic. Genuine recommends full synthetic for their 2 strokes. Since both of these companies provide 2 year warranties I would bet synthetic oil provides better protection at start up and continuos high rpm use. No dollar store oil for me. My scooter only takes about .75 lt. Dino oil today has all kinds of additives but even modern cars are needing semi or full synthetic if you expect the manufacturer to foot the bill for the engine while its under warranty. After the first oil change its synthetic for me Yes you have to go with what the manufacturer recommends especially on the more finely machined engines. Non-detergent dino oil is a great choice for a fairly dirty running GY6 since it does not keep the dirt suspended for the oil pump to send it back through the engine and accelerate its wear while on a full flow filtration engine yes a high detergent Synthetic that works with the oil filter specified by the manufacturer is the best way to go. With the Piaggio its the combination of Synthetic Oil, Filter Material and Engine Design that work to give you a long lived 50,000 mile plus trouble free ride. Everyone has to be mindful that The Ride is not just a GY6 or Yamaha 260 clone and includes other bikes that are designed from the ground up to get the longest service life using Synthetics and while a High Detergent Synthetic may be good from the Piaggio, Suzuki and other full filtration bikes it will indeed be of very limited value to most GY6 engines and could be detrimental in a particularly dirty running one. |
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Post by larrball on Apr 16, 2016 16:39:08 GMT -5
You're supposed to change the oil in your push-mower not just top off? Oops..... >'Kat The new Briggs EXI Engines are specifically designed to never need an oil change. Not sure how they pull that one off. Hope its not because they wear out before the first oil change would be needed. I have a B&S EXI mower and what is happing here is that the engine has little notches in the rings allowing it to slowly and safely burn just a small amount of oil. The ideal is that by the time you need an oil change you have already replace the old oil with new. Now if you look at the new B&S mowers you will not find a oil drain plug, yep go look, find it? Nope. Is it a bad thing that they stopped putting them on? Yep i think so as i use to be the guy you took your mower in for repair and now to change the oil you have to run it low on fuel, tip it over and drain it from the fill spout. What where you thinking B&S? Ahhh i see you weren't! As far as scooter oil for the 139-gy6 im with most everyone : Buy what works for you and your scooter fund UNLESS it's a 2 smoker, then it's Bell ray Si-7 all the way. I found it on Newegg with free shipping for $14.42 a Litter (1.5Qt) www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=2WH-001M-00018BTW the pic of the oil on newegg is old but you get the new stuff. |
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Post by JerryScript on Apr 16, 2016 18:24:16 GMT -5
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Post by rockynv on Apr 17, 2016 9:50:57 GMT -5
The new Briggs EXI Engines are specifically designed to never need an oil change. Not sure how they pull that one off. Hope its not because they wear out before the first oil change would be needed. I have a B&S EXI mower and what is happing here is that the engine has little notches in the rings allowing it to slowly and safely burn just a small amount of oil. The ideal is that by the time you need an oil change you have already replace the old oil with new. Now if you look at the new B&S mowers you will not find a oil drain plug, yep go look, find it? Nope. Is it a bad thing that they stopped putting them on? Yep i think so as i use to be the guy you took your mower in for repair and now to change the oil you have to run it low on fuel, tip it over and drain it from the fill spout. What where you thinking B&S? Ahhh i see you weren't! As far as scooter oil for the 139-gy6 im with most everyone : Buy what works for you and your scooter fund UNLESS it's a 2 smoker, then it's Bell ray Si-7 all the way. I found it on Newegg with free shipping for $14.42 a Litter (1.5Qt) www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=2WH-001M-00018BTW the pic of the oil on newegg is old but you get the new stuff. I really despise when you have to upend a mower to change the oil. Now I have a Self Propelled 36 volt Black and Decker and its just fine as long as you read the owners manual. Home Depot regularly has them on sale for $278 and they at that price they are a good value. I have not been able to run the battery dead even when mowing the neighbors easements and going over the front a second time I have always run out of will to continue before running out of battery even while mulching. On a GY6 it really does not matter as much however old fashioned dino is what it was originally designed for with no real filtration however you loose the real benefit of the high end synthetics on it and are mostly just throwing money away since you still have to change it per the original schedule. Again on something engineered for synthetic that specifies use of synthetic in the owners and service manual use nothing but synthetic on it. |
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Post by tortoise on Apr 18, 2016 23:22:28 GMT -5
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New Rider
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Posts: 7
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Joined: Apr 19, 2016 7:49:37 GMT -5
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Post by frasi on Apr 19, 2016 8:04:35 GMT -5
Hi, Just use the best possible synthetic oil, I have a TaoTao atm50, it only takes less then 1/4 of gallon of oil, $10 at most, its worth, to preserve the engine. Mine has 3500 miles (5200km) and still runs very strong, I have a top speed of 45mph on a flat road. Change the engine oil once a month, and the gear oil after every summer, take care of every other little things, like changing.fuel filter, fuel lines, and the scooter will last forever. Chinese scooter are inexpensive (however, between shipping and assembling it cost close to $1000..), but are not cheap, at least not much cheaper then any other scooter in that range of price. The engine are the same that the Honda use, the GY6, same parts and everything, the parts are Japanese, made in Taiwan, they are just assembled in China, its exactly the same thing. Also, use best possible gas (its only $3.00 to fill up!),  octane, Mobil or Sunoco. Good luck |
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New Rider
Currently Offline
Posts: 7
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Joined: Apr 19, 2016 7:49:37 GMT -5
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Post by frasi on Apr 19, 2016 8:09:44 GMT -5
Hi Friend, You are absolutely right, using cheap gas and oil, on a 50cc scooter, for what it uses, its simply non sense. Unfortunately there are a lot of people that use crap oil and cheap gas, to save a buck, and than they complain that "the scooter is cheap Chinese crap", when the only cheap thing is themselves. |
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Post by rockynv on Apr 19, 2016 12:19:43 GMT -5
Frasi - The engines are similar but not identical to what Honda made. Read the article that Tortoise posted and you will see an experts comments on the difference in the quality of the castings and how the excess porisity makes the Chinese GY6 a poor candidate for a synthetic oil.
Znens head castings were particulary notorious for cracking in the timing chain area they had so many gas inclusions in them. When I had the Znen bike the mechanic at one shop showed me the difference between the Chinese GY6 head and the Honda GY6 and when they are sitting side by side it is like night and day.
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Post by JR on Apr 19, 2016 12:24:22 GMT -5
Hi Friend, You are absolutely right, using cheap gas and oil, on a 50cc scooter, for what it uses, its simply non sense. Unfortunately there are a lot of people that use crap oil and cheap gas, to save a buck, and than they complain that "the scooter is cheap Chinese crap", when the only cheap thing is themselves. When you find any cheap oil or gas let me know and sense 50cc scooters are a dime a dozen why would anyone use high priced oil on a cheap scooter? I've got over 30k on 5 scooters all using dino oil, got 180k on a 1993 Chevy Silverado that still runs like a scalded ape and it's never had anything but dino oil. 3500 on a 50cc scooter? Ok betting if you change it regular it would still have the same miles on it using dino oil, mine does? So you using synthetic and others using other oils makes them cheap and you're not? JR |
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Post by ricardoguitars on Apr 19, 2016 18:00:54 GMT -5
The benefit you will see on a GY6 engine using synthetic oils is less frequent oil changes, synthetic oil doesn't degrade as fast as mineral oil.
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Post by onewheeldrive on Apr 19, 2016 20:01:00 GMT -5
The benefit you will see on a GY6 engine using synthetic oils is less frequent oil changes, synthetic oil doesn't degrade as fast as mineral oil. I'm just not too sure that would be a good thing, leaving oil in longer, without a real oil filter in these engines. I guess the question here in this case would be: What's worse? Oil breakdown or dirtier oil with no filter. One thing is for sure though, if we change it often enough we shouldn't have to worry a whole lot about anything, because ultimately in the long run with the quality of these Chinese engines-- we all know these cheap engines aren't going to last forever--- especially if you ride like I do, full throttle everywhere like a maniac with a BBK on a 139qmb. I have yet to get over 15k on one of these crankshafts, and I'm at about 54k on my odometer. So between every 10k-15k on my engines it's either new engine or rebuild time for me. |
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Post by JR on Apr 19, 2016 20:47:48 GMT -5
Scooter motors spend a lot of time at high rpm. They are no lawn mower engines. You can buy a gallon of 5w40 synthetic shell rotella t6 for $22. Kymco recommend full synthetic. Genuine recommends full synthetic for their 2 strokes. Since both of these companies provide 2 year warranties I would bet synthetic oil provides better protection at start up and continuos high rpm use. No dollar store oil for me. My scooter only takes about .75 lt. Dino oil today has all kinds of additives but even modern cars are needing semi or full synthetic if you expect the manufacturer to foot the bill for the engine while its under warranty. After the first oil change its synthetic for me Be sure to not use that "cheap" stuff at WalMart. But also do note they tell you the "conventional" 2 stroke oil is a good choice too? www.scooterloungeonline.com/genuinestellaoilDang they do the same thing for the 4 strokes? Surely there is no sales pitch here? www.scooterloungeonline.com/genuinebuddyoilandoilfilterNow also let's make sure we compare apples to apples? Comparing a Genuine scooter which also uses a "real" oil filter to a GY-6 is apples to oranges and do you know of a scooter with a "Chinese" GY-6 that offers a 2 year warranty? Now let's also review the Genuine FAQ and see how they want you to exercise the taking care of the scooter as to "not" void that 2 year warranty? genuinescooters.com/genuine_faqs.htmlTake note of how they want you to "baby" the engine in the first 500 miles? They are explicit on how to break it in and really don't want you to service it yourself so be sure to bring it in to the dealer so he make more money for "giving" you the 2 year warranty. I love the part of "if you insist" I mean how difficult can it be? Righty tighty, lefty loosey heck she didn't even break a fingernail! I don't think I heard the word synthetic any where? Now here is one of the many Genuine manuals we have here and it's the service manual for the Buddy 125 and no where I can find it says use synthetic oil and remember you are supposed to get a manual if you "insist" on doing it yourself? www.jr-richscooterdoc.com/Genuine_buddy125_service_manual.pdfWhat? You mean it's possible they want you to break in the engine with dino oil? How many scooter engines recommend synthetic breaking in the engine? I'm sure there are some but I haven't found that on a Genuine yet? Actually I haven't found any at all? scooterfocus.com/scooter_break-in.htmlblog.scooterunderground.ca/headline/scooter-oil-201-helping-choose-proper-scooter-oil/First paragraph here? www.taotao.us/default/assets/File/SCOOTER%20SAFE%20START.pdf Synthetic oil for a GY-6? = $100 saddle on a $10 horse.  JR |
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Post by rockynv on Apr 19, 2016 23:24:51 GMT -5
Like the $100 saddle JR. On a GY6 at best you could get the Super Tech 15W40 Rotella alternative in the $9.99 Gallon Jug for your 500 mile oil changes or just about dino any oil that meets the 4T Motorcycle Oil spec Super Tech 15W40 Dino Rotella Alternative (said to be universal and therefore meeting 4T)Super Tech-20W50-Dino Motor-Oil-1-Quart (said to meet 4T Spec). For my Piaggio powered bike I asked the manufacturers rep about those two oils along with real Rotella and the answer was no way. Use only 4T Synthetic in our newer series tight tolerance full flow filtered engines which means any 4 stoke they have made in about the last 25 years. Again use what is appropriate for what you have and try to understand why something would or would not be appropriate. Do not use synthetic in an unfiltered engine that you want any combustion by products etc to accumulate in the bottom of the sump to get drained out every 500 miles which is what you really want on a GY6. The 500 mile oil change is technically not because the oil is worn out but rather because those engines are not particularly clean running so that you need to get the dirt accumulating in the bottom of the sump drained out before it starts circulating back through the engine. |
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octane, Mobil or Sunoco.
