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Post by oldchopperguy on Feb 22, 2015 3:41:50 GMT -5
For those firearm enthusiasts who have discovered the reliability, durability and parts-availability of the classic Ruger 10-22 rifle and it's identical twin-brother, the "Charger" pistol, be aware, the pistol is no longer in production. So... If like many of us, you have decided having a handy, all-purpose or "bug-out" gun in .22 caliber is a sound idea, the supply of Chargers is fast drying up.
The 10-22 rifle and Charger pistol receivers are identical, and all the swell 10-22 rifle mags and accessories can be used to upgrade the Charger pistol action. The BIG difference is that the 10-22 is legally a RIFLE requiring a 16" barrel and an overall length of 26". The mechanically-identical Charger is legally a HANDGUN, so the barrel and overall length can be as short as you please. The only major limitations are NO shoulder stock or front pistol-grip is allowed on a handgun.
So... from a Charger HANDGUN receiver, you can build the handiest, nastiest "sawed-off" rifle you can dream up, but it's totally LEGAL, being a HANDGUN. Same principle as the super-popular AK-47 and AR-15 based HANDGUNS. But don't even THINK of making one of these from a 10-22 rifle... Uncle Sam will have you making little rocks from big ones for a couple of decades... LOL!
I just snagged a brand-new Charger receiver off Gunbroker.com for $185 which I'll build into my .22 bugout-gun using cannibalized parts from a 10-22 rifle.
Here's a pic of a stock Charger, and a shorty combat custom for your enjoyment... LOL! Doggone hard to beat this for "bang for the buck" in a caliber you can store THOUSANDS of rounds of ammo for!
Anybody wanting to get one (or more) of the very last of the Ruger Chargers, needs to act pretty quickly, or later pay scalper's prices.
Just a "heads-up" for Ruger fans on the site... As a side-note, a chopped and channeled Ruger Charger with a Ruger "Siamesed" pair of 25-round mags is a SWELL "little friend" to have with you on your scoot where legal. MODERN high-velocity .22 LR ammo packs well over 100 ft/lb of muzzle-energy even from a 4" barrel... up there with a 2" .38 SPL. revolver... And the little Ruger can put out 20 rounds in five seconds reliably... Not just a "big-boy's toy" but a serious defensive weapon.
Not to mention one "helluvalotta fun" for sport-shooting, camping, survival, pest-control or just plain "goofing off" etc.
Jus' sayin'... 
Leo in Texas
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Post by wheelbender6 on Feb 24, 2015 20:32:09 GMT -5
All the 1022s are great firearms. A friend of mine had one with a stainless steel receiver.
I still have my Ruger Mark II pistola. Looks like a little Luger.
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Post by oldchopperguy on Feb 26, 2015 9:24:13 GMT -5
All the 1022s are great firearms. A friend of mine had one with a stainless steel receiver. I still have my Ruger Mark II pistola. Looks like a little Luger. Yup! Bill Ruger was a true firearms genius, maybe even in the same ballpark with Sam Colt and John Browning. The original "grandfather" of your Mark II got it all started, and today's versions are STILL as good as a .22 pistol gets. Probably  % of handgun shooters started with the little standard Ruger .22. Then, as they progressed, they just modded and updated the SAME pistol... No fancy, big-buck replacements needed, thank you...
Old Bill was heavily influenced by the design of the WWII Japanese Nambu pistols. They were AWFUL guns, but Ruger saw the good concepts involved, and fixed the bad ones... Finally coming up with a top-quality ORIGINAL pistol that was VERY inexpensive to build, could be "mass-produced" in the family garage and sold mail-order for peanuts... Thus allowing anyone (I bought one as a little nipper in the fifties through an ad in "Boy's Life") for something like $15 or less, if I recall... NO complex laws back then. If a little fellow needed a GUN, he/she could just order one through the mail.
From what I've read, Bill Ruger was enamored with the COSMETICS of the German "Luger" even happy that George Luger's name sounded like his own. When he discovered the Japanese Nambu was cosmetically similar to the Luger, but used a simple sliding bolt action he got out the drawing board and the rest is history... "Ruger" sounded like "Luger" and he styled the profile of his new pistol to greatly resemble the appearance and ergonomics of the super-popular war-trophy P-08 German "Luger". So long as the Ruger functioned even reasonably well, that feature alone ensured his new .22 pistol's popularity. And function it DID! Better than most of its high-priced ($50, $75 and even MORE... LOL!) competition from Hi Standard, Colt, Smith & Wesson, Browning, etc. much to their chagrin...
Then, by totally redesigning the lock-work of the Nambu, and adding his own nuances for reliability and ease-of manufacture, he had a truly ORIGINAL world-class winner right out of the box! By today's way of thinking, he actually "reverse-Japanesed" his design, pulling off what the Asians have been doing ever since... He kinda showed them the way, so to speak!
...And the little gun never did require much final "tweaking". It was good to go, right off his garage workbench. Wish I still had my original, with red-eagle grips and wood "salt-cod" box! His partner, Alexander Sturm designed the logo, still used today, resembling a "Phoenix" which appeared in red on the first pistols. Upon Sturm's early and untimely death, the logo was changed to black in Sturm's honor.
Ruger designed SO many successful firearms, nearly every one properly aimed squarely at a huge market, ready to buy. OK, the "Woodside" O/U shotguns and the lever-action version of the semi-auto 10-22 didn't exactly excite American shooters... NOBODY wins 'em ALL... LOL! And I've never heard of any of his designs being less than life-and-death reliable, and target-accurate. Pistols, revolvers, sporting rifles and shotguns... Most every one good enough to be "morphed" into combat weapons if needed. The only "niche" Ruger did not enter to my knowledge was the field of repeating shotguns. Had he lived longer, surely he'd have made them, too!
What a guy! Hard-core American patriot, no-nonsense God-fearing, hard-working and a true genius concerning how to make great, affordable firearms with each design appearing just when Americans were ready, cash in-hand. His best examples include the original .22 pistol, the 10-22 rifle, his legendary single-action revolvers... the many variants of his indestructible bolt-action rifles and the legendary miniaturized battle-rifles based on the military M-14...
The "Minnie-14" is probably THE most prolific civilian re-make of a military rifle extant. (I guess the Kalashnikov AK-47 is THE most prolific gun in the history of the universe...) In .223 caliber, and later in 7.62 x 39 Russian, in all forms, semi-auto and full-auto, folding-stocks, stainless-steel, wood and composite... The little rifle is the most popular .223 and 7.62 automatic rifle ever made. It even serves in dozens of nations as their main military assault rifle, and hundreds of police departments as their rifle of choice for EVERYTHING but long-range sniping.
No matter how many brands a shooter or collector may have, it's almost a certainty his/her collection will include some guns from the fertile mind of Bill Ruger. His timeless designs always give major "bang for the buck"... Whether speaking of "greenbacks" or "whitetails"... LOL!
I truly miss major entrepreneurs like Bill Ruger... They are among the people who made America great!
Keep yer' powder dry!
Leo in Texas
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Post by wheelbender6 on Feb 27, 2015 20:52:11 GMT -5
Does Ruger make a saddle rifle (30-30)? I've wanted one since I was a kid.
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Post by oldchopperguy on Feb 28, 2015 0:52:31 GMT -5
Does Ruger make a saddle rifle (30-30)? I've wanted one since I was a kid. Sadly, not to my knowledge.
Centerfire lever guns are one of the few types Ruger never got around to. I'd just go with a Winchester 30-30... Marlin makes EXCELLENT saddle-guns too. And nowadays, the new Henry is very classic and good American quality... Other calibers available too, but you can hardly beat the old 30-30 for all-round hunting, camping, personal defense, etc.
Check out the various big outdoors equipment places like Bass Pro, Cabella's and such. Also, GunBroker.com. Every sportsman loves a good lever-gun!
Good luck in your search!
Leo in Texas
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Post by wilds on Feb 28, 2015 4:10:00 GMT -5
All the 1022s are great firearms. A friend of mine had one with a stainless steel receiver. I still have my Ruger Mark II pistola. Looks like a little Luger. I started with a Ruger Mark II and it is perfect as an entry-level weapon for target shooting. But when one gradually becomes better one will need a gun that is better and more precise. At that point I bought a Hämmerli SP20 which is in a completely different league for target shooting than the Ruger Mark II, the price is also in a nother ball park.  |
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Post by oldchopperguy on Feb 28, 2015 12:05:05 GMT -5
All the 1022s are great firearms. A friend of mine had one with a stainless steel receiver. I still have my Ruger Mark II pistola. Looks like a little Luger. I started with a Ruger Mark II and it is perfect as an entry-level weapon for target shooting. But when one gradually becomes better one will need a gun that is better and more precise. At that point I bought a Hämmerli SP20 which is in a completely different league for target shooting than the Ruger Mark II, the price is also in a nother ball park. Oh YEAH!
Those European serious target pistols ARE the cat's butt! Ferarrari quality and price too! Way back I got to shoot one and it will definitely make a mediocre shot "good" and good shot "dangerous".
They ARE in that rarified atmosphere of the electronic-trigger and "release trigger" guns of the rich and shameless... LOL! Great stuff if you can afford 'em!
Ride safe, and keep your powder dry...
Leo in Texas
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Post by wheelbender6 on Mar 1, 2015 20:27:47 GMT -5
I remember when they used to sell the Marlin 30-30 for under 200 bucks. That ship sailed a while back. Maybe a Rossi. My saddle rifle would not see heavy use. I have fired a 44-30 and it hurts.
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Post by oldchopperguy on Mar 4, 2015 16:47:31 GMT -5
I remember when they used to sell the Marlin 30-30 for under 200 bucks. That ship sailed a while back. Maybe a Rossi. My saddle rifle would not see heavy use. I have fired a 44-30 and it hurts. Yeah, the "Under $200 deer-rifle" has gone the way of the honest politician... I am old enough to remember the Winchester "94" 30-30 selling new for around $65... THOSE were the DAYS!
On a humorous note, I also got fooled once shooting a pal's Marlin lever-gun in .444 Marlin. Good Godfrey, did THAT thing KICK! He had a low-power brush-scope on it, and that thing gave me my first "scope-ring" black-eye"... He got the gun for a trip to Alaska... Just the thing for brown bears, dinosaurs, etc. HeHeHe...
You may be onto something with a Rossi, or maybe one of the Italian Winchester clones. They seem to be made well (they MUST be to stand up to Cowboy-Action shooting...).
Hope you get a great one!
Leo in Texas
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Post by geh3333 on Mar 5, 2015 18:28:00 GMT -5
I just recently acquired an armi jager ap74 " handed down from my uncle " its a 1970's rifle modeled after the first A1 m16's . they where used as training rifles for the military " while training in the Philippines . I have the same problem , they stopped manufacturing parts back in the early 1990's . u can still buy a few less important parts but they are also running low. Here is a couple pics. The last pic is my carry gun , its a full size rock island M1911 in 45acp . I've had if for over 2 yrs now and have never had a miss fire or any malfunction of any kind . I'm really impressed with the quality of the RIA's 1911's.  .  .  |
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Post by rdhood on Mar 6, 2015 10:29:56 GMT -5
Hyperbole anyone?. You can buy a receiver or build a receiver from 80%, and then put it in a pistol stock. There is absolutely no way anyone is ever going to pay scalpers prices when you could get a better-than-Ruger quality receiver and put it in a pistol stock at FAR less than scalpers prices.
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Post by geh3333 on Mar 6, 2015 12:51:24 GMT -5
I just recently acquired an armi jager ap74 " handed down from my uncle " its a 1970's rifle modeled after the first A1 m16's . they where used as training rifles for the military " while training in the Philippines . I have the same problem , they stopped manufacturing parts back in the early 1990's . u can still buy a few less important parts but they are also running low. Here is a couple pics. The last pic is my carry gun , its a full size rock island M1911 in 45acp . I've had if for over 2 yrs now and have never had a miss fire or any malfunction of any kind . I'm really impressed with the quality of the RIA's 1911's. . . That's actually the nice thing about rock island 's , there is usually no break in period like most 1911's . there is even a video of someone shooting 2 brand new 1911's . one is a kimber and one is a rock island. The more expensive number had multiple malfunctions but the rock island shot perfect right out of the box. If I recall there was one issue with a bad rd or something. But was not gun function related. Also many don't know that the cheaper mags ,like the 7 rd cheap steal colt mags can be made very reliable by just doing some dremel work . when I bought the 16 rd promag steal mag I saw that the reviews were terrible . when I received it I noticed that you could not even push the first few RDS out of the fully loaded mag. The rd was catching on the lip of the front of the mag. I compared it to my Novak mags and dremeled the top of the mag to match the Novak . I only used the 16 rd promag twice at the range and both times they worked flawlessly. I'll have to make a video on post it on youtube , to show everyone how to make a 15 rd " its actually 16 RDS " promag reliable. |
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Post by geh3333 on Mar 6, 2015 14:49:50 GMT -5
I should add over the two yrs or so I've only shot around 800 RDS through it.
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Post by oldchopperguy on Mar 7, 2015 11:48:28 GMT -5
Hyperbole anyone?. You can buy a receiver or build a receiver from 80%, and then put it in a pistol stock. There is absolutely no way anyone is ever going to pay scalpers prices when you could get a better-than-Ruger quality receiver and put it in a pistol stock at FAR less than scalpers prices. You bring up a VERY interesting point here!
There ARE match-quality receivers out there to replace the Ruger originals. They are NOT cheap, but are top-quality. Now the big question... And the BATF is DOGMATIC on the subject... Are the aftermarket receivers made to be built into a "10-22" RIFLE, or a "Charger" pistol?
By law, the receiver simply cannot be a "generic" replacement for both. The serial# on the new receiver has to be stipulated that it's for a rifle, or a handgun. Somehow though, I imagine the new receivers ARE sold simply as generic parts for either the rifle OR the handgun. I even see them listed on eBay, which violates not only eBay rules, but is completely illegal. The numbered receiver must be transferred only to a FFL licensee. But then, to run for president, a fellow is supposed to undergo a background check too... THAT lets out the past several heads of state... LOL! So much for the law.
While a generic rifle/handgun receiver won't "pass the smell test" with the BATF, I suspect nobody gives a dang anyway... LOL! But, considering the AWFUL penalties involved should a zealous BATF agent notice a pretty, bright-red receiver on my pistol, I just wouldn't risk it. The innocent action of unintentionally building a non-taxed or registered NFA "short-barrel-rifle" or "any other weapon" could send a decent citizen to federal prison for decades, with no excuses.
Now, if you happen to have the skills and equipment to actually make your own receiver from scratch... That is another story altogether! I'd forgotten about that loophole! Our benevolent (LOL!) government DOES allow us to make our own tasty drink, and our own firearm, so long as both are for our personal use...
Those generic receivers are definitely worth researching. If somehow they slip through the cracks of the handgun/rifle parts controversy, they would be mighty handy for the home-builder or pro alike!
Certainly worth checking into!
Leo in Texas
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Post by oldchopperguy on Mar 7, 2015 18:54:59 GMT -5
I just recently acquired an armi jager ap74 " handed down from my uncle " its a 1970's rifle modeled after the first A1 m16's . they where used as training rifles for the military " while training in the Philippines . I have the same problem , they stopped manufacturing parts back in the early 1990's . u can still buy a few less important parts but they are also running low. Here is a couple pics. The last pic is my carry gun , its a full size rock island M1911 in 45acp . I've had if for over 2 yrs now and have never had a miss fire or any malfunction of any kind . I'm really impressed with the quality of the RIA's 1911's. . . That's actually the nice thing about rock island 's , there is usually no break in period like most 1911's . there is even a video of someone shooting 2 brand new 1911's . one is a kimber and one is a rock island. The more expensive number had multiple malfunctions but the rock island shot perfect right out of the box. If I recall there was one issue with a bad rd or something. But was not gun function related. Also many don't know that the cheaper mags ,like the 7 rd cheap steal colt mags can be made very reliable by just doing some dremel work . when I bought the 16 rd promag steal mag I saw that the reviews were terrible . when I received it I noticed that you could not even push the first few RDS out of the fully loaded mag. The rd was catching on the lip of the front of the mag. I compared it to my Novak mags and dremeled the top of the mag to match the Novak . I only used the 16 rd promag twice at the range and both times they worked flawlessly. I'll have to make a video on post it on youtube , to show everyone how to make a 15 rd " its actually 16 RDS " promag reliable. Geh3333,
Woo-HOO! I well-remember those Armi Jager .22 AR-15 clones. Marvelous little toys! I believe they were better than many of the "plethora" of NEW M-16 wannabes from modern manufacturers. The internet is loaded with vids of Chiappa and other makes that look great, and do NOT function well...
I was pretty young when the Armi-Jagers were available. If my old memory serves me (and THAT is not a certainty...) they were imported and sold by Mitchell Arms, and considering their well-executed die-cast construction, I'd bet the farm they were an original GERMAN design, probably by Erma. Mitchell offered a number of nice arms of various types, including the AR-15 rim-fires, Hi-Standard .22's and shotguns, various Lugers, and some swell single-action Colt clones.
I'll bet you CAN find parts for your rifle at Numrich Arms. They have EVERYTHING!
I too am a BIG fan of the arms from the Philippines. Armscor, ATI, Rock Island and such appear to be at least "loosely" affiliated. Modern AR-15 and AK-47 style .22 rim-fires abound (though not quite as nice as the old Armi-Jager versions). And then there's the "Squires-Bingham" .22 semi-auto that's been around since I was a little nipper... The "poor-man's Ruger" it has a near cult-following, and can't be beat for an affordable, reliable little .22 semi-auto.
If you get a "Jones" for a vintage Colt Detective Special .38, there is also a very nice all-steel close copy available from Armscor and at least one other Filipino maker. Everybody over 50 is a sucker for a good .38 snubby! ____________________________________________________
Now... concerning those GREAT 1911 .45 ACP pistols... I'm DEFINITELY with you on them! My original GI 1911 is getting VERY long in the tooth, and due for retirement. So, a few years ago I was seduced by this ATI sub-compact sweetheart... I'm not sure just WHICH maker produced mine. I don't believe ATI is a manufacturer... Mine probably came off the Armscor assembly line. It came with virtually every enhancement imaginable (except ambidextrous safety) from the factory.
The dang thing is SO pretty, I couldn't resist adding the wild spalted-maple grips... Just me...
While these "micro" compacts DO sacrifice a lot to chop off that last quarter-inch of barrel/slide length, that very fact soon proves how well the pistol is made. (Kimbers, Colts and others often do NOT work well without smithing) and guns costing over a thousand bucks SHOULD not need smithing to make them work... THIS one is a winner.
My gunsmith tells me Kimber, Smith & Wesson and some other high-end 1011 builders actually get some of their receivers, slides and barrels from RIA, Armscor and affiliated Filipino companies. I would NOT be surprised. The quality is SUPERB. Attention to detail is as good or better than anything wearing the Kimber trademark, and, as you mentioned, they WORK right out of the box.
The Filipinos make their 1911's to government spec's. And they work like they should. If like me, one wants the smallest 1911, he or she should not expect full-sized 1911 levels of reliability from the micros, due to the really "wonky" recoil-spring design necessitated by the short barrel/slide (which John Browning NEVER would have approved of... LOL!). Get the compact "run in" and reliable, and practice with a standard size .45. Keep the compact for "O.S." needs only.
Keep yer' powder dry!
Leo
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% of handgun shooters started with the little standard Ruger .22. Then, as they progressed, they just modded and updated the SAME pistol... No fancy, big-buck replacements needed, thank you...
