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Post by blarboose on Jul 29, 2014 14:57:24 GMT -5
So, as I was removing the chasis and air box and such so that I could get at the inner parts of the bike to check the valves, I got a nasty surprise; a nice big crack in my intake manifold! I guess this would explain the bike's behavior; with the intake manifold cracked, there's gonna be no vacuum at low RPMs, and at higher RPMs the vacuum would be strong enough to keep going even in spite of the crack weakening it. But, as soon as the RPMs drop lower, the pull of the vacuum isnt gonna be strong enough with the crack weakening it, and the engine would die. Not to mention that some of the air/fuel mixture might even be spraying out of there or otherwise escaping and never making it to the engine. This SEEMS like it is the most likely culprit, but then again it COULD still be the valves, couldnt it? Im getting a ride from a friend tomorrow to go to the nearest store that MIGHT have the right size intake manifold (Norm's cycle center in wets Homestead PA, in case anyone here has dealt with them and might actually know if they do or not) but since theyre more for motorCYCLE parts Im hoping against hope that they'll have the correct motor SCOOTER part. If they dont have what I need, Ill just order it offline and deal with waiting for it to arrive. But for now, a question; Should I even bother with the valves at this point?Given my track record with doing work on this bike, Im thinking "If it aint broke dont fix it" very much applies here. Sure, I could check the valves and it might do some good. But knowing my luck, Ill do more harm than good, and the bike wont work right even after I get the intake manifold replaced. So, should I mess with the valves or no? Is it worth the risk? Or should I wait and see if the new manifold gets the bike running, and only mess with the valves if it DOESNT?   |
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Post by phssthpok on Jul 29, 2014 19:41:22 GMT -5
as an *extremely* temporary fix you can slather the outside of the manifold with some RTV silicone and let it cure. That should last you at least a couple of days while waiting for your replacement manifold to arrive (Actually... I'd order 2 or 3 manifolds. They're inexpensive, and are notorious for going bad like that).
Doing the silicone can also seal it up enough for test and tune diagnostics to see if that solves all you problems, or just *some* of them.
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Post by alleyoop on Jul 29, 2014 19:57:10 GMT -5
WOW!! I have never seen a Intake Manifold so bad IS THAT DRIED ICE CREAM ON IT   |
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Post by blarboose on Jul 29, 2014 19:59:43 GMT -5
as an *extremely* temporary fix you can slather the outside of the manifold with some RTV silicone and let it cure. That should last you at least a couple of days while waiting for your replacement manifold to arrive (Actually... I'd order 2 or 3 manifolds. They're inexpensive, and are notorious for going bad like that). Doing the silicone can also seal it up enough for test and tune diagnostics to see if that solves all you problems, or just *some* of them. You have to understand that I got this bike all of maybe a month or two ago, so in terms of spare parts, supplies, accessories, etc, I have quite literally NOTHING on hand unless I go out and get some. The silicone sounds like a great idea but its not something I have laying around. In fact, pretty much EVERYTHING is something I dont have laying around. XD Plus like I said, Im getting a ride tomorrow to go to a nearby shop and see if they have the part in stock, so hopefully I wont need to wait for it to arrive. |
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Post by blarboose on Jul 29, 2014 20:01:42 GMT -5
WOW!! I have never seen a Intake Manifold so bad IS THAT DRIED ICE CREAM ON IT Yeah I have no idea what that is. XD Im GUESSING its the adhesive that you find on duct tape. The reason I think this is because the hose on the air intake was wrapped in duct tape by the previous owner, so Im guessing the heat from the engine caused some of the adhesive to melt/drip and get on there. Other than that I have no idea. Its like... a waxy/greasy substance, but also kinda rubbery and sticky. Its weird. XD |
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Post by blarboose on Jul 29, 2014 20:02:22 GMT -5
But anyway do you guys think that this was the cause of the problem, or do you still think it was the valves.
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Post by alleyoop on Jul 29, 2014 20:13:11 GMT -5
Blarboose, yes loss of vacuum would cause it to only be able to run at higher rpms and they will die at low rpms. Just like tight valves really. But it could be both so you will not know until you change the Intake manifold and if it still does it then adjust your valves.
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Post by blarboose on Jul 29, 2014 20:35:24 GMT -5
Thats what I figured. Thanks.  |
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Post by blarboose on Jul 30, 2014 19:26:41 GMT -5
Ok, went out this morning, got the new intake manifold, popped in on and... promptly cracked IT too by tightening the nuts too tight.
IN WHAT UNIVERSE DOES METAL CRACK THAT EASILY? DAMMIT! Seriously though, it what reality is the tiny amount of pressure applied by a nut being tightened enough to crack a 1/4 inch thick piece of metal? TT_TT
It was only a SMALL crack (like, and actual CRACK, not a giant ravine) so I decided to see if it would run. I took it for a ride, and it ran GREAT. Cleaning out the carb jets before really helped, and replacing the intake manifold fixed the problem with it dying when it should have idled.
But of course, now that the NEW one is cracked too, its only a matter of time before that crack gets bigger and I have to do this all over again...
Is there any way to repair this thing? Like, is there something I can get from home depot or auto zone or something that I can use to patch this thing up? And I mean as a permanent repair, not a temporary one.
(SERIOUSLY THOUGH. HOW THE DOES A BIG CHUNK OF METAL CRACK SO EASILY)
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Post by alleyoop on Jul 30, 2014 19:42:29 GMT -5
Your own fault really, you cranked on the nuts, your lucky you did not break the stud in the intake. I have changed many and never a problem. And you should order a couple of the intakes they are not expensive and do not crank on them jut nice and tight it has a rubber O-ring gasket on the bottom to seal.
It is not harden metal as you can tell it does not weigh a heck of a lot. If that piece was solid metal it would be pretty heavy.
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Post by blarboose on Jul 30, 2014 20:03:02 GMT -5
Your own fault really, you cranked on the nuts, your lucky you did not break the stud in the intake. I have changed many and never a problem. And you should order a couple of the intakes they are not expensive and do not crank on them jut nice and tight it has a rubber O-ring gasket on the bottom to seal. It is not harden metal as you can tell it does not weigh a heck of a lot. If that piece was solid metal it would be pretty heavy. Alleyoop I suppose it is, but it still makes no sense that it would break that easily. Hardened or not, one would not expect a piece of metal to crack so insanely easily... I mean GLASS probably wouldnt have cracked with so little pressure. I mean, I wasnt exactly JAMMING it on there like crazy. I was just tightening it with a normal ratchet, and it wasnt even that tight yet. Its like it was super crazy tight and I was tightening it even more. Anyway, Do you know of any way I can repair this? The crack in the new one is still very small, so Im hoping there is a way to patch it up and keep it from getting any bigger. |
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Post by alleyoop on Jul 30, 2014 20:25:38 GMT -5
Lets see the crack put up a picture of it, it depends where it is cracked at.
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Post by blarboose on Jul 30, 2014 20:37:06 GMT -5
Lets see the crack put up a picture of it, it depends where it is cracked at. Alleyoop Exact same place as the other one, just much thinner/not as deep, and doesnt reach as far. Imagine the old one, but as more of a hairline fracture than a full on break. Ill get pictures in a bit. |
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Post by alleyoop on Jul 31, 2014 14:55:36 GMT -5
Waiting on the picture of the new intake manifold that cracked.
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Post by blarboose on Jul 31, 2014 16:03:36 GMT -5
Sorry, some stuff came up last night that I had to deal with and it was a long night. Ill get the pictures as soon as I can.
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..BAD TO THE BONE..