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Post by bwader on May 22, 2013 12:49:00 GMT -5
I found this video on utube and its a lot simpler than I thought it would be to replace the top end of the engine. Going to try it, and see happened to my engine! I finally got today and tomorrow off.
This gave me more confidence to DI myself. Hopefully I can fix it without having to take more of the engine apart. Depending on if I need a new piston and cylinder I might as well spend a little more on a big bore kit.
Had I had no problems with the engine I wouldn't even give this a second consideration. But makes sense if I'm replacing the same parts might as well upgrade.
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Post by bwader on May 20, 2013 23:05:24 GMT -5
Yeah you might need 2 bricks! I did anyway. First one I used cracked to pieces but pretty much stayed in one piece. ;D
It worked to get the new gear started. With the 3 arm puller it was a pain in the just using a socket wrench. Might of been easier if I had a vise to hold it down.
I had a crescent wrench and rag to wrap around the 3 arms to hold it in and to help hold it in place. In right hand I used a socket wrench at first, realized it was going to be a slooooow hard wrenching process.....so I just used that impact wrench a little at a time.
Before it the engine locked up, I got up to 6,000 rpms and about 35-40mph I didn't go faster than that. My rpms at FOT before is around 6,900-7,100rpms with the stock gears ( at 50-55mph and 15gram sliders ).
I got 10 gram sliders in the variator ready for when I do get it fixed.
Yeah its sad 3,300 miles keeping oil changed often and max rpms around 7,200 most I ever had was 7,800 with 10 gram sliders.
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Post by bwader on May 20, 2013 12:45:31 GMT -5
Its been raining lately so I'm studying the exploded diagrams and repair manual. So I'll know what I'm doing and to know what to look for and this is for Mr Palmetto I still have a STACK 20 or so of RED BRICKS with HOLES in them to use at my disposal!  LOL With 3 holes in them. I like to joke. Its all in good positive fun to have a friendly laugh. Palmetto, that's a great name for an Exterminator! Mr. Palmetto Bug Exterminator INC. Any way I hope we all had a good laugh or smile by now. I'm looking at the repair manual pdf on here to prepare and make use of a rainy day. |
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Post by bwader on May 19, 2013 17:12:49 GMT -5
when I had the valve cover off and the plug out I would have tried to turn the engine over . As for the loose nut that is a head bolt , so the head is/was not torked correctly . Sounds like a manmade problem . I wish you luck I hope no crank damage . John I tried that too after you posted it. With the spark plug out it was tan a little on the rich side. I wrenched them snug. 3 were okay and the 4th was a little loose. I put enough force to tighten. It wasn't any more than 1/8 turn loose. Next tool I'm getting is a torque wrench one of these days. Man made problem? I didn't over torque the head bolts, or maybe if tightening that one loose bolt threw it off. I could have loosed all 4 and star tightened. |
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Post by bwader on May 19, 2013 16:25:53 GMT -5
Are you not the guy who decided to jury rig the gear change with "a red brick with holes in it", and had problems installing the gears and mentioned sanding the shaft to get it in but then tapped it in with a hammer? I believe you opted to Not press off the old gear, and press on the new gear and also mentioned that the shaft might be installed backwards. And you kinda shrugged that off. No disrespect but that is not top quality mechanic work and i would look at that being all the causes of your problem. Bet when you take the cover off you're going to see a cluster duck of damage. From my heart I'm sorry it happened, but when, you posted how and what you did, i thought that was a hassle waiting to happen. Chinese scoot or not, red bricks with holes in it are not in my scooters tool box, and surly should not be used when your messing with internal engine gears. I hope it's a simple fix, but if you reread that post i bet you won't like what you read. I'm sorry for your problem. I know you were excited about the performance upgrade. I know i would be. LoL, I'm that guy palmetto, let me clarify, I'm taking this in stride. Anyway, I got the original 13 gear off with a gear puller and impact wrench. I had mentioned all that but the only jury rigged thing I did was get the new gear STARTED to press ON the new 15 tooth with a red brick.It didn't leave any marks on the gear and it broke the brick in many pieces. LoL I thoroughly cleaned the whole gear including in between the teeth with liquid wrench with one rag, then gear oil with another rag to wipe the whole gear again. Then once I had it set in I took the 3 way gear puller and pressed it in, then slowly used the impact wrench to get it pressed in. Then I questioned whether or not I had it on there the right way. I thought back and I KNOW I put it exactly the way it was. I tend to "Nuke" stuff (if you were in the Navy you'd know what I mean, or overthink something and make it complicated when its not) Doesn't mean I destroy LoL just means I overthink. I didn't sand anything, that was just was just a thought. When I put the gear box back on I tapped lightly to get the middle gear shaft to go inside the bearing. Ok now that I cleared that up, I took the cvt cover off already I tried to rotate the Variator C-clockwise and clockwise its stuck, mind you the belt was OFF. The wheel rotates when I rotate the clutch. I have an Engine problem. Only thing I did inside the engine was adjust the valves I was hearing chattering before it was pretty loud. This paragraph is the day before I did upgrades. I rode home from work 44 miles roundtrip (before upgrading gears, tire the day after) and when I checked my max speed on GPS it said 50mph and I was going at least 55mph for a top speed that morning wind/temp./fuel air mixture considering. Last mile or so it made the chattering noise I thought it was the cvt, I checked it everything looked fine when I took out the variator,sliders, and auto clutch. With the variator and belt off I started up the engine and the crank shaft rotated and I knew then it was chattering inside the engine, so I adjusted the valves, ran it, it went away, then rear tire and taller gears..... I hope I'm not confusing anybody. |
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Post by bwader on May 19, 2013 0:03:45 GMT -5
Did it run out of oil? or was it low on oil or did you not have the Plasctic shroud over the motor? But to find out you will need to take the head off to see the piston, you may have dropped a valve so take the valve cover off and see if you can see one of the valves stems lower than the other, or maybe a piece broke off and is binding the cam. Alleyoop Oil level good wasn't low and I just changed it 200-300 miles ago and changed oil once I got it out of the crate then at 200 miles, 500 miles, at 1000, 2000, and at 3100 miles Shroud has never been taken off. It did chatter some and went away, I was thinking it was normal from reading about so many people having that issue after adjusting their valves. Only other thing when I had the cam cover off to adjust valves I checked all four of the nuts, one was loose tightened a little. After that I replaced rear tire and gears to 15/37. Max rpms would go to 6,000 on the test run with 15 gram sliders. Thanks I need the direction to know what to look for when I take a look at it and take it apart. Its my first time on a scooter, I took apart the top end of my motorized bicycle and piston |
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Post by bwader on May 18, 2013 23:12:29 GMT -5
Plug was tan it didn't look bad. Is it reasonable to rebuild it? I don't understand why it seized? I was going about 35mph at 5,500 rpms then all of a sudden it stopped abruptly. I pretty much get that the engine is toast but would rebuilding the top end be worth it? If its the piston seized to the cylinder, that could be rebuilt right? Or is it just better to just swap out a whole new engine? it would be simple and just cost the money. Its about 400 bucks with shipping to get a new engine from scrappydog. I'm at a loss  You feel my pain? I know I'll need more information and take it apart to make an informed de |
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Post by bwader on May 18, 2013 16:06:29 GMT -5
Asking for advise here.
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Post by bwader on May 17, 2013 21:19:14 GMT -5
 I took the CVT off and tried turning my variator counterclockwise and clockwise it won't budge. This was supposed to be the last upgrade then I would just ride it as it is. Only thing I can think of is unbolt the engine and take it apart to see what happened. When I found this out I just went to my shed and played my drums for a few hours. I hate that I will have to probably spend a lot more money just to get it running again. I rotated the clutch and it turns the wheel so that's good at least. I don't really want to spend money on a new engine. I was intrigued by that "200cc" engine kit. But after all these headaches I learned a lot. But this is too much
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Post by bwader on May 17, 2013 5:02:22 GMT -5
I've gotten parts from them too, all positive. At the bottom of their page it says ships from P.R. Or Puerto Rico.
Yeah its funny I got parts from them FASTER than U.S. mainland
Even faster than the final drive gears I got from N.C. and I live in Virginia! Those took over a week! Delayed sending it out on their part. But that guy sells his stuff cheaper than other places so can't complain.
I don't think they have the greatest quality but they are cheap or reasonable on stuff I bought.
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Post by bwader on May 16, 2013 20:50:55 GMT -5
Thanks Alleyoop! I'll try that tomorrow. Its been a long day in the 90F shade wrestling the rear tire on. Was so excited, hopefully its not the motor being seized.
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Post by bwader on May 16, 2013 18:48:39 GMT -5
I'm so frustrated today. I took a test ride. Adjusted my valves both to .004. New rear tire and 15/37 gears. Checked oil, tires, fuel, everything together I got about 3 miles into the ride and all of a sudden, engine stopped. Had to push home a few miles. When I try to start. It just clicks. Won't rotate. So would this be a fuse? I'm afraid there is something seriously wrong with the engine.  |
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Post by bwader on May 16, 2013 18:18:25 GMT -5
I replace my rear tire after a few hours of work standing on the sides and tire ironing.
Had trouble filling in the tire, bead wasn't setting. I spent 4 bucks at the gas station rocking the scooter back and forth and no luck.
Ended up using some Slime put a couple squeezes in. I rotated a bunch and put weight on the tire then tried and finally it filled with air!
Okay now I have a dilemma. I took it out for a test ride 3 miles or so and top rpms are 6,000 rpms I made it to 40mph at least.
Then all of a sudden, Something locks up then the engine cuts out!
It won't start, it just clicks. I'm so frustrated I spent a lot of hours today and yesterday.
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Post by bwader on May 16, 2013 10:52:40 GMT -5
I think it would be worse for the engine to put in SHORTER gears because of higher rpms overall. But if someone wants better acceleration and doesn't care about losing some top end that would be a move to do. I think putting in Taller gears its a bigger load the engine has to move but its got to be better than having to go higher rpms for the same speed. After all we don't run our cars at the higher rpm we do on scooters. Of course most of our cars are built with bigger engines made for going faster carrying heavier loads. On this chart 13/40 gearing 13inch wheel and I inputted 1.6 for trans. because at 7,000 rpm my scooter goes 54-55mph. So With 13/37 I had just for giggles in the middle. Then on the far right is the 2.46 gear ratio with the 13/37 gears. 68mph at 7,000rpms! Ha! yeah right!  www.wallaceracing.com/gear-speed.php Engine Speed (RPM) MPH 3.077 Gear 13/40 13/37 15/37 3.07 Gear 2.  Gear 2.46 Gear 8000 RPM 62.  MPH 68.09 MPH 78.61 MPH 7500 RPM 58.92 MPH 63.83 MPH 73.69 MPH 7000 RPM 54.99 MPH 59.58 MPH 68.78 MPH 6500 RPM 51.06 MPH 55.32 MPH 63.87 MPH 6000 RPM 47.13 MPH 51.07 MPH 58.96 MPH 5500 RPM 43.21 MPH 46.81 MPH 54.04 MPH 5000 RPM 39.28 MPH 42.56 MPH 49.13 MPH 4500 RPM 35.35 MPH 38.30 MPH 44.22 MPH 4000 RPM 31.42 MPH 34.04 MPH 39.30 MPH 3500 RPM 27.49 MPH 29.79 MPH 34.39 MPH 3000 RPM 23.57 MPH 25.53 MPH 29.48 MPH 2500 RPM 19.64 MPH 21.28 MPH 24.56 MPH 2000 RPM 15.71 MPH 17.02 MPH 19.65 MPH 1500 RPM 11.78 MPH 12.77 MPH 14.74 MPH 1000 RPM 7.86 MPH 8.51 MPH 9.83 MPH I'm predicting I'll get 60-62mph as a new realistic top speed Well got to get off here and try it out! |
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Post by bwader on May 15, 2013 20:39:48 GMT -5
Well I didn't have to sand any thing like I thought. All I had to do was tap it in. I got to get a larger socket to take my rear wheel off and put on that Avon tire. I got tire irons and going to soap it up after letting all the air in the valve stem. After that fill it up with air and take it for a top speed run! I'm keeping the 15 gram sliders in, I'm sure I'll want to change but I want to see what happens with my taller gears as they are! After all its only 11 bolts and the cvt nut to change the variator weights. With an impact wrench that's a quick job.  |
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Gear 2.46 Gear 
MPH 68.09 MPH 78.61 MPH