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I'm not bashing cheap Chinese bikes. They are what they are.

I'm bashing people that try to make them into something they are not.

When I bought my first Chinese scooter, that was all I could afford (the first of two).
I worked on it like everybody else (too much) and kept it running. But unlike a lot of people here, I knew my Chinese scooter was not the best quality and had no illusions it was as good as a Genuine or Kymco, which were very popular scooters at the time.

But back then a quality scooter would set you back $3000. Now there are several budget Taiwanese models that cost just a few hundred dollars more than a Znen. Without ever having owned a "budget" Taiwanese model, some people on this forum keep saying their "better" Chinese scooters are just as good. I have owned both, and just about anyone that has knows there is a big difference.

The point of a much lower cost of purchasing a Chinese scooter just isn't valid anymore. This includes some brand new Taiwanese machines, not just getting lucky and finding a good deal on a used Japanese scooter.

There are many threads in this forum where people are asking advice on how to fix their Chinese scooters, some of them very frustrated.

There are many threads in this forum where people ask for purchasing advice. It seems if a non-Chinese solution is suggested, there are many people here that just have to bash it and put it down.

What's good for the goose is good for the gander. And when the shoe is on the other foot, some of those very same people really don't like it

Good point. If you own a smaller four-stroke 50cc and ride it consistently in a 45 mph speed zone, it would be WOT all of the time. A 150cc engine would be running easily and well below the redline under the same conditions, and as a result would have a longer engine life.

But according to my theory, if you ran the 150cc in a 65 mph zone at WOT throttle all of the time, you would stress the engine harder than running a smaller 50cc engine at WOT. If both engines were a GY6 design made out of the same metal, the 150cc should wear out first because of the additional power and stress. However, both a quality made 50cc and 150cc engine should last a long time abused at WOT if the maintenance is kept up.

If I was bragging, it wasn't intentional, just trying to show what a value a lightly used quality machine can be compared to buying Chinese. I would never be as uncouth as you to state that "I could buy any bike I choose new".

But since you asked, here goes. Since 2010 I have bought a new 2010 Honda Elite 110, new 2012 SYM Wolf Classic 150, new leftover 2009 Suzuki TU250X, new 2012 SYM HD200 EVO, new 2012 CPI Oliver City 50, new 2012 Tomos Nitro 150 and a new Honda CBR250R. And since you were making a point about your claimed ability to "buy any bike you choose new", I paid cash money for all of them, except the 2012 CBR250R, which I financed for my son and he makes the payments.

If you would have just looked at the machines in my signature, you could have saved yourself the embarrassment of looking like a wanna be stuck up person. And if you're not embarrassed that's OK, 'cuz I feel embarrassed for you ;D

I don't recall reading any agenda about this forum being "geared towards Chinese", after all the name of this forum is "It IS the Ride".

This forum seems to be geared towards helping and giving advice on how to fix scooters. It just so happens that a disproportionate amount of the threads are about fixing Chinese made scooters, I wonder why?

You think $800 was a good deal on a Chinese 50cc? Think again.
I bought a 2007 Yamaha C3 with 750 miles for $1000. It was three years old and looked brand new without a scratch. 44 mph top speed and 115 mpg. Water-cooled and fuel injected, you could literally cruise at WOT forever, It was almost as fast as my two-stroke SYM DD50 that I bought for $500. Yeah, that's right, a Taiwanese built 49cc two-stroke with 1200 miles that I fixed up and invested $700 total into and it ran 47 mph.

The Yamaha C3 ran perfectly for the couple of years I owned it and never needed anything but oil changes. I sold that terrific little scooter for $800. Beat that deal with an $800 Chinese 49cc.

And yes, I sold the SYM DD50 for the same $500 I paid for it.

I am on a crusade. I am sick and tired of people who buy Chinese scooters insisting on two things.

1. They are as good or almost as good as a Taiwanese or
Japanese equivalent.

2. They are a better deal and save money.

I think almost all of the people that claim these two things have only owned a Chinese machine and just don't get it. I myself owned two Chinese scooters and figured out they don't save money. I have also owned more than a dozen Taiwanese or Japanese scooters/motorcycles and do all of my own maintenance and repairs.

Kymco, SYM and Tomos all make Taiwanese manufactured scooters that are assembled in China. I don't know how many times I see people here willing to spend a few extra hundred dollars on a Chinese made Znen to get better quality. And yet they are unwilling to spend a few hundred more to get a budget Taiwanese machine that is a much bigger jump in quality?

At this point I'm almost ready to give up explaining that buying a cheap Chinese scooter rarely saves money. I said almost ;D

And let's not forget to mention the infamous Chinese PDI. You take a brand new Chinese scooter and replace some of the essential parts and then hope that it keeps running with some degree of reliability.

I don't know exactly when people began to accept buying something brand new that was broken and didn't work correctly, and then were happy about it?

Looks like those Chinese are way smarter than a lot of Americans!
(Or at least a lot of people here )

There nothing wrong with buying a Chinese scooter for a cheap price. I'm not sure that's the smart thing to do, but if you're a decent scooter mechanic with extra time and lots of patience, it might work out OK for you.

But it is wrong to try and justify the purchase of a Chinese machine by trying to convince people (or yourselves) that they are something they just aren't!

After the engine is warm, you should never need to run with the choke open. This indicates a lean condition.

If the idle and 1/4 or less throttle runs better with the choke partially on, you need to adjust the fuel mixture richer or switch to one size larger pilot jet.

For 1/4 to 3/4 throttle, raise the slide needle one or two notches or add a shim.

For 3/4 to WOT, switch to a larger main jet.

It's actually not quite as simple as that, but this will get you started in the right direction. It takes a lot of trial and error to get it perfect...

If your carb is faulty or not the correct size for the engine, it will never run right.

If the airbox/intake is too large for your set up, it will never run right.

You need to check for vacuum leaks and/or air leaks in the intake manifold and upstream towards the airbox, especially where the intake hose attaches to the carb.

These things are definitely possible when you buy a really cheap Chinese motorcycle/scooter...

I give you credit for still trying. I would have never bought it in the first place. But if I had, it would already be thrown out in the junkyard or landfill.

Just think, what if you would have applied all of these hours you've been working on this project to a temporary job or overtime at your regular job? With the extra money you could have made a much better purchase.

Was it worth it and did your really save any money?

Tomos is manufactured by SYM and assembled at their mainland China plant, along with Lance scooters and several lower priced SYM models.