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Post by keltex78 on Feb 19, 2014 10:53:50 GMT -5
Further adventures with the CVT on my 244cc Jonway @ ~4400 miles: In an attempt to quiet a noisy variator, I removed and cleaned the variator, and replaced the factory rollers with a set of Dr. Pulley rollers, same weight and micrometer verified same size. I had also purchased a spare belt. While I had the CVT apart, I replaced the belt as the factory Gates-branded belt was stretched out a bit as compared to the new. Assembled all, and I still got the same clatter from the rollers, but the bike ran perfectly, so I drove it to work yesterday. On my way back home, with less than 50 miles on the new belt and rollers, at highway speed, I immediately lost all torque and coasted to a stop on the side of the road. The motor was still running and revved fine, so I pulled the CVT cover off and this is what I had left of my belt:  Stranded on the side of the road, I called a friend who came and drove me home, where I got my original Gates belt and brought back to the scooter. I installed the belt, cranked the bike, and drove the ~10 miles back home. On arriving, I checked the belt and found this deep gash beginning to develop in the previously-undamaged belt:  I'm not quite sure what is causing this gash as there are no foreign obstructions that match up with this. My only idea now is that the variator pully is pulling the belt too far to the outside causing the belt to abrade against the inside of the housing? This only happened after I serviced the variator; there were absolutely no issues before! What am I missing here? |
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Post by ramblinman on Feb 19, 2014 13:07:55 GMT -5
check the cvt cover for any wear/skid marks. i haven't had this problem so i don't know how to fix but at least you will know where the belt is coming in contact with the cover. if it is contacting at the variator then maybe go back to rollers and a new belt and see if the belt is fine after a few miles.
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Post by alleyoop on Feb 19, 2014 13:29:02 GMT -5
Take a picture of the whole CVT are so we maybe able to spot what the belt is hitting. Also running at high speeds like you do do not buy cheap belts, Gates or Bando or Mitsubishi . When you cleaned out the Variator did you re-grease it, if not you will get the roller shatter.
Alleyoop
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Post by keltex78 on Feb 19, 2014 15:07:23 GMT -5
- I did not re-grease the new rollers when I installed them. I was told that the Dr. Pulley products are intended to be used dry. Even so, I'm at the point where I think I'll just grease them anyway to reduce the clatter.
- On my return trip, I did not have the CVT cover installed, so it's not on that component; it would be on the CVT housing. I do see what looks like a place where the belt has rubbed against the housing, but have no idea why it suddenly started doing so after 4k+ miles, and immediately after I rebuilt the Variator? I'm planning setup a camera pointed at each of the pulleys this evening, crank the bike with the cover removed, then rev the engine up to normal running RPM while recording video, so I can see exactly what the belt is doing at that speed.
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Post by alleyoop on Feb 19, 2014 15:19:05 GMT -5
Now since you rode it without the cover I wonder if something was hanging or maybe one of the guide pins that hold the cover in place had come partially off and hanging down to cause those tears in the middle of the belt.
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Post by keltex78 on Feb 19, 2014 15:32:54 GMT -5
Now since you rode it without the cover I wonder if something was hanging or maybe one of the guide pins that hold the cover in place had come partially off and hanging down to cause those tears in the middle of the belt. I looked at that, and could see nothing around the housing hanging loose... All the guide pins are very securely in place. If I find anything interesting tonight with my video attempt, I'll post that up on Youtube and link it here... My main thought if it is even possible, could the belt be riding up too high in the pulley? Thereby abrading against the inner face of the CVT housing. I've just ordered a new belt (again), a Gates Powerlink. I can't do anything until that gets in so I'm back in the truck now that the weather is turning nice for scootering here.  |
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Post by alleyoop on Feb 19, 2014 15:36:55 GMT -5
Yes it could be hitting something in the cvt cover. So look at the cvt cover for black wear marks, belts usually will do some bouncing between the variator and the clutch pulley. So if the belt is riding really high on the Variator it may be bouncing and hitting the inside top of the cover.
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Post by keltex78 on Feb 19, 2014 17:40:27 GMT -5
I just got my diploma today; I'm now an official Doctor of Idiocy...
So... watching the belt path with the bike on the center stand and there is NOTHING in the path.
<Scratch head> <Sudden flash of "Doh!>
With the center stand up, the stand rides DIRECTLY on the bottom of the belt causing the furrow I saw. So basically the bike is okay. The cheap belt I bought to keep on hand as an emergency spare must have just been straight-up JUNK resulting in the initial failure. Nothing but Gates for me now thank you very much.
Now back to our regularly scheduled scootering.
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Post by alleyoop on Feb 19, 2014 18:22:21 GMT -5
FANTASTIC!! one to keep in the back of our minds because that was a puzzling scenario the middle of the belt frayed all to heck.
Alleyoop
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Post by rockynv on Feb 19, 2014 23:53:48 GMT -5
Yep you really should not ride without the cover in place. You will only need to get a boot lace or pant leg caught once to break you of that and possibly end your riding carear. If the Gates belt had snapped at highway speeds rubbing on the stand it could have cut you to the bone and done some life altering damage.
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Post by mopedjay on Feb 24, 2014 10:38:04 GMT -5
yeah i bought one of those $8 belts off ebay and it didnt even last one fast take off it shredded like that
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Post by phssthpok on Feb 24, 2014 12:59:23 GMT -5
Just to make sure I'm clear on the issue and final analysis:
You serviced the Variator and replaced old rollers with new Dr. Pulley sliders, and replacing the factory Gates belt with a new 'el cheapo' brand belt 'while you were in there'. Within 50 miles said 'cheap' belt failed. You re-installed the 'old' gates belt to get the scoot home, but left the cover off for the short ride. Upon arriving home you discovered some severe 'mystery' wear on the belt. Subsequent investigation revealed that without the cover on, a part of the center stand was allowed to make contact with the belt, causing the wear. Final conclusion is the 'new' belt was just plain junk and simply failed, and the 'wear' on the gates belt was a result of the cover not protecting the belt allowing the center stand to make contact, not a symptom of the initial belt failure.
Sound about right?
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Post by spandi on Feb 24, 2014 13:26:51 GMT -5
Buy Chinese made scoots, just not their belts.  (you may also wish to consider replacing all the Chinese "stove-bolts" holding up your muffler as well.) |
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Post by urbanmadness on Feb 24, 2014 13:47:14 GMT -5
Yeah, every 250 I've seen with the cf250, you can't ride with the cover off becuase the centerstand will either rub the variator or the belt.
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Post by mopedjay on Feb 24, 2014 16:41:12 GMT -5
Yeah, every 250 I've seen with the cf250, you can't ride with the cover off becuase the centerstand will either rub the variator or the belt. yep same with the hondas though i ripped my center stand off cause it hung down too low |
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..BAD TO THE BONE..
