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Post by gy6girl on Apr 15, 2013 13:06:31 GMT -5
A weak spark can be keeping it from igniting.
Replace the coil as well as the spark plug.
Plus, if he is spraying in starter fluid and it still not getting a pop... again, weak spark could do that.
It might not be the problem, but it could be and it's something that at least needs to be eliminated.
If he can hold his finger over the spark plug hole and feel a suction and pressure, then the piston rings aren't blown and they are doing their job.
I don't see it as a compression problem.
It still could a manifold leak, or like said above, could be the muffler clogged.
But my guess, if it can't ignite starter fluid, which is heptane, butane, propane, and either all mixed together, then something is wrong with your igniter.
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Post by natedoggaz on Apr 16, 2013 2:13:14 GMT -5
chihuahuas - you owe me a $ (or a Coke) =)
my paypal account is #thisscootispi$$ingmeoff
Pulled the muffler
Pulled the plug again and sprayed carb cleaner right into the plug hole and still nothing.
Going to buy a coil tonight online from Amazon or wherever.
Funny thing is that I dont really smell gas when I hold the throttle wide open when trying to start it. On my little 50cc I smell gas when I try to start it... I tried sucking on the vacuum hose that connects to the petcock as well hoping that I could get some fuel flowing, but the filter is full of it.
Also going to get a compression tester from Harbor Freight tomorrow...
...I'm not giving up... what else can I try?
ND
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Post by chihuahuas on Apr 16, 2013 7:19:42 GMT -5
LOL LOL " #thisscootispi$$ingmeoff " That's a good paypal if I ever saw One. I'm sending a cup of SUCKs to go with Your Scooter.  |
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Post by natedoggaz on Apr 16, 2013 11:22:48 GMT -5
Lol! Great picture!
Another thing I noticed was that the plug was totally dry... doesn't smell like gas and is not wet from fuel...
Starting to think its.a.fuel or vacuum issue again... maybe something with the Carb?
ND
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Post by gy6girl on Apr 16, 2013 11:26:40 GMT -5
Did you try draining the carb to see if there is gas in it?
Forgot if you said you did or not, just replying to your no gas smell.
If you don't know...
The tube with the screw on the end, usually has a spring around the tube as well, it's down by the CVT, that drains the carb.
If you open the screw and gas comes out, your carb is getting gas to it.
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Post by natedoggaz on Apr 17, 2013 2:20:49 GMT -5
Bought a compression tester at HF today and hooked it up to the scooter...
I was not getting any readings though. Possibly the one I have is not sensitive enough. The first notch on the gauge is 15 psi, and it did not reach that reading. On average what psi reading should I get?
The air gets trapped in the gauge, so when I pressed the release button air came out. Its possible the $17 I spent on the gauge may be because its a ... I sprayed air from my compressor into it and didn't get even 30 psi..
Here is some other things I did..
I swapped a coil with my other scooter, a known working coil and it did not fire. I also funneled some gas into the plug hole and tried again - still nothing...
URGH - what is wrong with this thing!
ND
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Post by gy6girl on Apr 17, 2013 2:59:53 GMT -5
Hmmm... Well... So there is a sufficient spark and it won't ignite anything. For fire to exist there must be fuel, heat, and oxygen. You got the fuel. The spark is the heat. So logic would point to no air?  Still seems weird that you can't ignite the fuel, even when you pour it right in. Maybe it's the gap in the spark plug? I am just throwing things out to maybe stumble onto something.  |
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Post by chihuahuas on Apr 17, 2013 8:13:41 GMT -5
over 100 psi on healthy motor.
Crack open throttle when testing compression.
Do a dry test and a wet test comparison ..
Squirt oil in the cylinder through the spark plug hole. Rotate engine to work it in. Reread compression. This will tell if you have a leaky valve or messed up rings. If the reading jumps wet, the rings are not sealing right. If the reading stays low the valves are leaky or blown headgasket.
Sometimes a cylinder will dry out. Moister gets in and pops the carbon off the rings and the top of the piston. This will leave a condition where the engine is fine but no start, no compression happens. Squiting oil inthere corrects this enough to fire the engine. Once it runs awhile the carbon reseals and you are good.
My 50cc did this. It sat for 10 days. Came up to it and kicked the engine over. No compression. Wierd!!. I rotated the engine over to work in some oil and after 20 minutes the compression returned and she fired up.
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Post by natedoggaz on Apr 17, 2013 17:39:38 GMT -5
Well...i have been trying to start it for a few days now. Wouldnt that in fact be lubricating the cylinder using the electric start?
I guess i could try squirting in some oil to see if it works. Just regular motor oil? ...not sure how im going to be able to get it in there...
I'll check the plug gap but its brand new and i gapped it per the stamp on the scooter.
How frustrating...
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Post by natedoggaz on Apr 17, 2013 17:42:27 GMT -5
Ive also read somewhere about a kickstand killswitch.
I have been trying to start with the kickstand down, but i am getting spark... so probably not it...
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Post by natedoggaz on Apr 18, 2013 10:27:42 GMT -5
...after reading many troubleshooting articles and from suggestions on this post, I now believe it is a compression issue. The scooter sat for months before I bought it
Probably can try putting some oil in the plug hole. I'm going to start with 1oz or so to start
I'm definitely not getting 100-150 psi...
ND
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Post by natedoggaz on Apr 19, 2013 1:40:34 GMT -5
Possibly some developments...
So I have this 50cc scooter that works. I pulled the plug on it to feel what the compression was like with my finger...
Went to my 150cc and put about 1oz or so of 10w30 into the plug hole. I cranked it over a few times with the kickstart. Put the plug back in and nothing...
I pulled one of the vacuum hoses on the intake and sprayed in carb cleaner....nothing
Pulled the plug and funneled in some gas... it did not try to start, but I heard some strange hissing noises coming from the engine after the starter stopped making noise.
Pulled the plug and felt for compression with my finger. It was just as strong if not stronger than my 50cc!
I pulled the working CDI from the 50cc and swapped it with the 150 CDI. I heard some strange noises like every 3 seconds when trying to start it like it would pause for a split second. So either it is trying to start, or the starter is going out... That started immediately after the known working CDI went in.
Whats really weird is that I took the 150cc CDI and put it into the 50cc scooter and it started up right away...
still frustrating me...any more suggestions?
Thank you!
ND
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Post by alleyoop on Apr 19, 2013 2:20:52 GMT -5
OK, time to check the timing on this thing. Take the Valve cover off and align the Cam Sprocket as if your going to adjust the valves. Now look at the FLYWHEEL and the pointer on the Casing and see where it is pointing to on the FLYWHEEL marks.
Take a picture of it.
When you testing for compression you have to hold the THROTTLE WIDE OPEN othewise you will get a low reading.
When testing for SPARK you have to hold the PLUG AGAINST the motor or VALVE COVER. It may spark on the FRAME but that is NOT GOOD ENOUGH. If the ground from the frame to the motor is bad or not connected the PLUG WILL NOT FIRE WHILE IN THE MOTOR.
Just F.Y.I when starting DO NOT OPEN THE THROTTLE WIDE OPEN, if you do that sucks in AIR and no fuel. Keeping the throttle closed helps to suck fuel out of the carb.
Alleyoop
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Post by gy6girl on Apr 19, 2013 10:43:45 GMT -5
So you got it to run with a different CDI? And how does this not solve the issue?
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Post by natedoggaz on Apr 19, 2013 13:42:38 GMT -5
No.... I put the cdi from the scooter that is not working into a known working scooter and it started up... leading me to believe it is not the cdi since it worked in the other scooter
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..BAD TO THE BONE..