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Post by oldchopperguy on Jul 27, 2017 0:42:19 GMT -5
Well boyz n' gurlz...
I'm realizing how old I really am, and I'm emptying out my storage, and went into an outbuilding I haven't entered in 30+ years.
Under some old parts was my Dad's vintage toolbox that accompanied me to the dragstrip back in the sixties. I've moved 8 times since 1970, and that old tin treasure always made the move, though long forgotten. My friends who enjoy my posts on ItIsTheRide know that most every time I make a post, another member trashes me, calls me "squid" maligns my lady friends and in general, insults and disrespects what I post. Says it can't be, impossible, I'm lying and so on.Inside that toolbox, along with some old Harley points, plugs and a wrench, were the TIME SLIPS from OSWEGO DRAGWAY right where I put them on a summer Sunday in 1964, or 65. They laid there forgotten for more than fifty years. Oswego Dragway was big-time back in the day. Sadly, the property is now owned by a nursing home. I wonder how many residents there RACED on that same property many decades ago?
These are the runs "Old Blue" made for which I've taken never-ending trashing from "Piston Guy".I wouldn't waste five minutes posting these for his edification, as I don't have to prove anything I've done to such a troll. However, his incessant insults on my posts wear my patience thin, and, have no doubt harmed my standing with my long-time pals on the site. So... For anyone who is interested, here are records of my three Sunday elimination runs of 11.21@122.3-mph, 11.06@128.6-mph and 11.4 @ 129.9-mph... AND, the day's final trophy-run with my diminutive 76-pound friend Janice aboard of 10.68@139.7-mph. And for the record, HER name is JANICE. Not "Oompaloompa". Please save such names for insulting women in YOUR own life, not mine.  These ancient timeslips triggered a renewed interest on my part to see just HOW unique "Old Blue's" quarter-mile times actually were, and, I got a surprise. In the mid-sixties, there were at least 10 street-driven choppers/bobbers turning in times in the low elevens, and high tens.
And, one notable Knucklehead set up much like my ride, with not much Harley left save for the heads... billet steel cylinders and hand-cast crankcase housing a monster stroker crank which ran a blistering 9.45@150+mph! THAT was near all-out DRAG-BIKE performance, and, Yes, THAT was a STREET-DRIVEN bobber, the run made at Pamona, CA. I know my incredible little Flying Squirrel went to CA and became a stunt-woman and pro-drag-bike driver for hire. I have to wonder if just maybe she was aboard that incredible 9-second Knucklehead in Pamona? For my good friends here, enjoy the nostalgia of pretty slick ride from the past. As for my caustic and insulting critic, no hard feelings, but YOU are as WRONG as you are OBNOXIOUS. You have some excellent skills and knowledge, and it's a real shame you don't use them to help and encourage other members, rather than to insult and disrespect them.
Enjoy...Leo in Texas
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Post by wheelbender6 on Jul 27, 2017 18:23:46 GMT -5
Glad you found the time slips, Leo. You know we believed you without seeing them.
A good forum needs plenty of disagreement, but Piston Guy went way beyond that.
I wish more people knew how to argue and discuss ideas without hurling insults.
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Post by oldchopperguy on Jul 27, 2017 23:04:47 GMT -5
Glad you found the time slips, Leo. You know we believed you without seeing them. A good forum needs plenty of disagreement, but Piston Guy went way beyond that. I wish more people knew how to argue and discuss ideas without hurling insults.
Thanks for the vote of confidence... Have a bone on The Old Chopper Guy!
You can't imagine how SURPRISED I was when I opened that rusty old toolbox... Suddenly it was 1965 again, and the memories came flooding back. This was LONG before the Japanese bike invasion and "crotch-rockets"... The fastest bikes from the factory probably were the Triumph Bonneville 650, the BSA Hornet 650 and the seldom seen Norton and Royal Enfield 750... All capable of no better than a 14-second quarter mile, at maybe 100-mph on a good day. Hop up one of these to the max, and they still would have to REALLY hustle to break into the mid twelves.
Modern bikes make our old builds seem downright slow, but in their day they were awesome. I was racing in a "run what ya' brung" class, facing whatever my competition might be that day. Ya call out the other guy, run yer' mouth, then, take it to the Christmas tree and see who gets bragging rights, and who gets a reality-check. I must admit I truly do LOVE cashing "reality checks"... My three elimination runs that day included beating a street-converted Anglia gasser, a wild scratch-built bike powered by a 6-cylinder 2-stroke Mercury outboard motor (which came VERY close to beating me) and another Harley. THAT one was actually a drag-bike they put a phoney license plate on and called it a street-bike. We watched as the crew did some major didling with the motor and fuel, and, switched the rider to a small, jockey-sized Asian fellow. My tiny "protégé" Jan elbowed me and said "... Hey Big Daddy, YOU will NOT beat that little guy! YOU are just TOO FAT. Better let me show him what a REAL lightweight can do..." Oh, YEAH!!! Ah, OUCH... How the truth hurts... HeHeHe... But I did weigh near 375 and Old Blue weighed about the same. Shaving 300 pounds off DID make enough difference to ensure the win! 
I do believe she could shave a half-second off most any bike's best run because of her "near weightless" size, AND her type-A Alpha dog, totally fearless driving. She was an ANIMAL on the track... And that animal turned out to be a "flying squirrel"... If Jan is still alive, she's 76 years young and probably still known by that well-earned moniker... LOL!
Determined to give it 110% she raced in world-record run "Rollie Free" style... clad only in her skivvies... Yeah, you COULD do that stuff back then. She didn't wear sneakers either... Sometimes I wonder just how much psychological advantage her "undressed to thrill" technique may have provided... 
Rollie Free was an Indian dealer making a land speed-record attempt on a Vincent. He was one of our heroes back then, and all I can say is that little Janice looked a lot better in that state of undress than Rollie did... LOL! She ran that quarter just like old Rollie, but with her right arm wrapped around the base of Old Blue's ape-hangers and her left hand on the foot-shift. Throttle wide open and no clutch involved... I ground off every other tooth in the Harley tranny's 2n, 3rd and 4th gear and shifting without the clutch worked great! Of course, when she slammed the old hog into 1st sans-clutch, chin on tank... I suppose it WAS a tad "hard" on the tranny, but OMG, WHAT a LAUNCH!... Oh well, no apparent harm done!
Below is that famous pic of Rollie Free on his record run...
OK, in yer' mind, picture that Vincent with ape-hangers, and picture Rollie as a 2/3 sized version of Vanna White in bikini undies, with her hand on the foot-shift... Naah... I'm an artist with a good imagination, and even I can't fantasize THAT well... HOO-HA, WOO-HOO and LOLOLOL! 
Those days were very special, never to be seen again. I'm glad I lived in them...
Ride safe, and put on some clothes... and a helmet!Leo |
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Post by cyborg55 on Aug 5, 2017 15:50:07 GMT -5
Harley switched to left hand shift in1975all others before were right hand shift
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Post by cyborg55 on Aug 5, 2017 16:10:23 GMT -5
And if she had her right hand around the base of the apehangers,,, you meant the dogbones,, who was manning the throttle ?,,,
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Post by cyborg55 on Aug 5, 2017 16:16:15 GMT -5
Pistonguy is a pro,,, he developes and has developed some of the most exotic race engines ever devised,, and has worked with Indy to current working superbike and nascar teams,,, he knows his stuff,,, this I personally know as a fact,,, he has forgotten more than any of us will ever know about engine theory,,, including me,,, and I grew up in a race shop and come from a line of a racing family,,,
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Post by wheelbender6 on Aug 6, 2017 9:10:33 GMT -5
I never questioned Piston Guys experience and accomplishments. Just some of his comments.
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Post by oldchopperguy on Aug 8, 2017 13:20:06 GMT -5
Harley switched to left hand shift in1975all others before were right hand shift Hand-clutch with "mousetrap". I think '57 may have been the first year for the foot-shift on the big twins. Jan raced laying with her chin on the tank, shifting the foot-lever with her left hand. No clutch used. When the Christmas tree lit, she opened the throttle wide open (no spring return) and shoved the shifter into first sans-clutch. Up-shifts done the same. I raced that way too, BUT did use the clutch off the line... With my 375 pounds aboard, I figured a no-clutch launch might just tear the tranny out of the frame... LOL! Like I said, "probably a tad hard on the tranny, but OMG! WHAT a launch!"That mill was SO under-square that it would only rev to 3,500 rpm no-load in neutral. John Deere would have LOVED it! Leo |
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Post by oldchopperguy on Aug 8, 2017 13:34:52 GMT -5
" class="user-link js-user-link user-3375 group-4" href="/user/3375" itemprop="url"><span itemprop="name">cyborg55</span></a></span> said:</div>And if she had her right hand around the base of the apehangers,,, you meant the dogbones,, who was manning the throttle ?
__________________________________________________________________________
Nope, the base of the bars... no dogbones, the apehangers were tall enough... LOL
When the Christmas tree lit, she opened to WOT (no spring return) and shoved it into first gear sans-clutch. With every other tooth ground off the gears, WOT shifting sans-clutch worked great on the strip, or running for money.
Normal riding, of course I used the clutch like anyone else. The hacking of the gears only caused a slight "chugga-chugga" lugging at super low rpm. This kind of butcher technology was common back then, and while crude, it worked EXTREMELY well... Just like the 2-stroke chamber pipes worked well on our 4-strokes, and still do today.
Things are SO different now, a half-century later.
I looked on the Net, and find to my total surprise, modern Harley BAGGERS, STREET-DRIVEN turning in the LOW TENS!!!
THAT is a whole new world of "cruisers"... Makes "Old Blue" look downright slow, even though they're hauling touring gear down the track!!!
HMMM... Wonder what a tuner guru could do with a new INDIAN CHIEF???
Leo (quite happy these days on a scooter...) in Texas
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Post by oldchopperguy on Aug 8, 2017 14:02:07 GMT -5
Pistonguy is a pro,,, he developes and has developed some of the most exotic race engines ever devised,, and has worked with Indy to current working superbike and nascar teams,,, he knows his stuff,,, this I personally know as a fact,,, he has forgotten more than any of us will ever know about engine theory,,, including me,,, and I grew up in a race shop and come from a line of a racing family,,,
Piston Guy may have marvelous credentials, but his attitude negates ALL of it. He's been calling me a liar for months, and has been DEAD WRONG every time, INCLUDING my long time successful use of chamber pipes on 4-strokes.I am unfortunate to be "blessed" with a 60-year-old stepson with a doctorate in aeronautics. Retired from Lockheed with all the credentials in the world... And the same arrogant "I know everything, YOU know nothing" attitude. Years ago, I thought he'd get a kick out of my company pilot looping our Aerospatiale helicopter during my aerial photo shoot of a property. Instead, he unloosed a tirade of "looping a helicopter is impossible and I can prove it" on me, deriding me and calling me a liar... Just like Piston-Guy... Well, looping copters is commonplace today. I recently asked him if he'd like to apologize to me for trashing me in front of his Mom.
Nope. I'm still a lying jerk even though our pilot did exactly what I told him we did.Some people even with marvelous credentials are educated far above their intelligence. Or, even worse, are so full of their own self-importance that they feel obligated to "put others in their place" through their overblown, arrogant self-aggrandizement. The right to free speech does NOT license anyone to yell "FIRE" in a theater and a great resume, education and accomplishments do NOT license anybody to be a jerk. Including ME, PISTON GUY, and my own STEPSON, whom I love, but cannot stand to be in the same room with. I can think of NOTHING, absolutely NOTHING more irritating than doing/making something successful, telling others about it just for fun, certainly not bragging, then having an "expert" stuffed-shirt call you a liar, saying he/she can "prove" it's impossible. Back in the Stone-Age days of shade-tree mechanics, we did the "impossible" on a daily basis. Thank God we were NOT hampered by computer-science, flow-charts and almighty "theory". All this modern technology is marvelous... in its proper place. It's making the best transportation ever. But 50 years ago, if something looked like a good idea, we tried it. If it really WAS impossible, we found out soon enough, when it didn't work. No high-tech needed.
Such is life, and sometimes it's extremely irritating.Leo (NO problem with accomplishments, ONLY attitude) in Texas |
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Post by rockynv on Aug 9, 2017 22:54:45 GMT -5
Leo - Its amazing what one can do when they don't know it can't be done. Sometimes too much book knowledge can hinder rather than help advancement since it causes folks to put blinders on limiting the scope of their realm. Others have trouble visualizing things from a word picture and need a full set of drawings and 3D models to even get a clue of whats possible. I get this at work all the time. You can't do that using that or that problem absolutely can't be caused by this however once the Root Cause analysis is done we find out a new set of possibilities not covered by the book.
I am closing in on retirement age now however its nice to be able to work with the younguns and make advances they said were impossible or inconceivable. Did one the other day that was bid out at close to $100,000 that they let the old out of touch guy have a crack at and 3 hours later we were done and productionalized. My boss came by near the end of the day concerned about my wasting time in what he considered a Rabbit Hole and when he asked how much longer I told him 5 hours ago it was completed just after my second cup of coffee. Asked when it would be put into production and the answer was the same 5 hours ago. His comment was "We sure got out moneys worth this morning. Must have taken some really hard thinking to pull that off so quick. Some here don't appreciate the stuff you do here every day and I wish there was a way to better reward you besides the gift cards we are allowed to pass out." Probably won't even get a "Good Job" digital thank you card on that one but at least someone up the food chain appreciated it.
Great find in the tool box! Perhaps you will put those slips in a frame with a few photos now for you memory wall. Maybe the folks at the nursing home may appreciate a copy of the frame showing the history of the site.
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Post by spandi on Aug 9, 2017 23:34:59 GMT -5
Sorry Leo, but when I first read the title I thought it was going to be a story (like on the George Noory radio show) about walking around a corner and finding yourself in 1967. (but I guess in a way it was.) I wouldn't worry about it too much, you know what you did and that's all there is to it. A little something from the old days. (You can see even more on Youtube.  ) |
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Post by cyborg55 on Aug 10, 2017 21:42:25 GMT -5
I hate to be a drag ol man ( even tho I'm not far behind you) there's no way a guy let alone a chick drops a big inch Harley into gear under load from neutral ,, it would break every shaft and gear set in the box if you could get it to go into gear in the first place,, I'm sorry chopster but I'm callin bs on this one,, and the only way that tank was pulling anywhere near a 12 was on an 1:8 mile ,,,fuel bikes were only a tic off the numbers you posted,, you'd have to have real live gumball slicks (current for the day) and screw the rim to the tire ( current for the day) to keep the rim from spinning in the tire,, too much conjecture here,, you didn't just waltze up with a driver and rip sub 12,second second quarters when dedicated nitro fuel bikes were barely making those numbers all because the tires werent upto it
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Post by rockynv on Aug 10, 2017 22:55:05 GMT -5
Yet those are 1/4 mile timings and speeds.
Folks who were in the jet set of racing said similar about my kid brothers pea green 67 Falcon. Impossible, they just should have been glad they weren't racing for pink slips when he beat them with 10 second quarter miles from an old street car that he drove to and from the track and was his daily driver. You could have bought a house here for what he put into that 351 Cleveland back in the day. It was just a sun faded pea green 2 door brick that was blue printed, braced and Bossed out underneath from front to back.
Now he is a respectable businessman driving a Honda MiniVan or Suv and wishes he had invested all that money he threw into engines and race fees at property or other investments so he could have been semi-retired already.
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Post by oldchopperguy on Aug 11, 2017 21:02:33 GMT -5
Leo - Its amazing what one can do when they don't know it can't be done. Sometimes too much book knowledge can hinder rather than help advancement since it causes folks to put blinders on limiting the scope of their realm. Others have trouble visualizing things from a word picture and need a full set of drawings and 3D models to even get a clue of whats possible. I get this at work all the time. You can't do that using that or that problem absolutely can't be caused by this however once the Root Cause analysis is done we find out a new set of possibilities not covered by the book. I am closing in on retirement age now however its nice to be able to work with the younguns and make advances they said were impossible or inconceivable. Did one the other day that was bid out at close to $100,000 that they let the old out of touch guy have a crack at and 3 hours later we were done and productionalized. My boss came by near the end of the day concerned about my wasting time in what he considered a Rabbit Hole and when he asked how much longer I told him 5 hours ago it was completed just after my second cup of coffee. Asked when it would be put into production and the answer was the same 5 hours ago. His comment was "We sure got out moneys worth this morning. Must have taken some really hard thinking to pull that off so quick. Some here don't appreciate the stuff you do here every day and I wish there was a way to better reward you besides the gift cards we are allowed to pass out." Probably won't even get a "Good Job" digital thank you card on that one but at least someone up the food chain appreciated it. Great find in the tool box! Perhaps you will put those slips in a frame with a few photos now for you memory wall. Maybe the folks at the nursing home may appreciate a copy of the frame showing the history of the site. Rockynv, YOU do GET it...! Have a bone! Leo |
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