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Post by geh3333 on Dec 28, 2015 16:34:16 GMT -5
Very good advice rcq , the only issue I have is that I still believe it could be the starter clutch . not that it def is , but it is still possible. I say this because like I stated earlier . with mine , I had only so many rollers making contact when trying to spin the crank . I had slippage and then seizure do the power of the starter being lost at slippage . if the plug is removed , there is now less resistance and the crank may now turn with out the clutch slipping. So its still not 100% clear . he only thing he can do is to either tear the side case of and inspect the starter clutch , or he can buy a new starter and see if that works first . I've tore mine apart so many times , so I'd inspect the starter clutch since I can do it and have it back together in 30 mins . but in his case , I'd prob buy a new starter since they are cheap and see if that solves the issue. Yea hopefuly its the starter, Ill have one on by the 30th For the starter clutch im going to need to remove the Freewheel correct? That's correct , the flywheel has to be removed to get to the starter clutch. I use a steering wheel puller " my flywheel puller was stripped " . |
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Post by geh3333 on Dec 28, 2015 16:30:43 GMT -5
Wow, they ran it into the ground !! I'm sure it died on them and they left it where it died. Soooooo, where to begin ? Hmmm , you need to buy a new ignition and get a diagram to reconnect it. This way you 100% sure its right. After that it may actually start.
Is it turning over at all ?
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Post by geh3333 on Dec 28, 2015 16:00:50 GMT -5
Would you feel call comfortable running it between 9-10k for 10 miles straight ? I think we all have the same concerns about high rpms because we have no real data on if the engine will hold up and how long it will last running a scoot tuned to hit that high of an rpm. That's not the only issue . if a scoot is tuned to hit 10k , then even takeoffs will be in the 9k range or higher . so the scoot will have a normal running rpm between 6-10k rpms ! Just to hit 40 mph you will be in the 7-8k range . the weights needed to hit those rpms would be around 6-8 grams depending on the cc's of he engine . at 20mph you would be around 5-6k rpms! Its starting to sound ridiculous to even try it , lol. Maybe if you had a 232cc engine , then you can use heavier weights to reach the 10k range . maybe 10 grams , that way you can be around 40 mph at a lower rpms and so on. We have to remember that these variators need a certain weight to be able to push the belt up the face. They were designed to run between a specific rpm . so if we tune the CVT to hit the 10k range. , we would look pretty funny screaming down the road at 20mph rpms sounding like a crouch rocket , lol. Yes, with the little more attention I mentioned. CVT logistics aside thats under 10 minutes at 70mph. Thats has Insurance Built in. I don't see anything that Shows me It couldn't and live to do it many more days. You make a great point with the valve springs " both spun in the same direction " !! Very nice pick up . When it comes down to it , we need some true data when pertaining to high rpm running . in a crazy scenario like the following : We get only one vehicle for the rest of our lives , and its a scoot with a full built taida engine . but if something happens to it THATS IT !! We must now walk for the rest of our lives. No fixing it or buying a new one . not one of us would run this engine over 8k . actually we would prob keep it around 6-7k max , lol. It would take a good deal of testing what parts will last and what parts would fail if ran at 10k for extended periods. In my opinion taida is a very good brand , but is no better then Honda, and Honda " being the maker of the gy6 engine" ran these engines through many tests " I'm sure " and came up with the 8k redline. One of the main reasons the clone China engines break is because the engine case is not built as good , the bearings , crank , top end and whatnot are all cloned and not as strong as the true Honda built gy6. Some do last but many have issues. They use the same 8k rpm range with under quality made parts , so its not a surprise when problems occur. Many of the China scoots break down in the first 1500 miles. Bring a good brand equal to Honda into the mix " like taida" and u had a good quality made engine that can now hold up to the 8k redline . I'm sure that hands tested the gy6 engine up to and over 10k . I'd like to know why " other then heat " they came up with an 8k redline ? |
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Post by geh3333 on Dec 28, 2015 15:34:13 GMT -5
Worn idle gear bushing ? Like rcq stated, the gear spins on a shaft " no bearings or bushings "and the shaft slides into each side of the engine case and cover.
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Post by geh3333 on Dec 28, 2015 15:27:59 GMT -5
Watching the variator for clutch slippage will prob not work , since the slippage and seizure is happening so quick . it will be almost impossible to tell if its slipping. The variator still moves a little " just like mine did" but it all happens so quick we don't know how much the variator should be moving .
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Post by geh3333 on Dec 28, 2015 15:24:53 GMT -5
Very good advice rcq , the only issue I have is that I still believe it could be the starter clutch . not that it def is , but it is still possible. I say this because like I stated earlier . with mine , I had only so many rollers making contact when trying to spin the crank . I had slippage and then seizure do the power of the starter being lost at slippage . if the plug is removed , there is now less resistance and the crank may now turn with out the clutch slipping. So its still not 100% clear . he only thing he can do is to either tear the side case of and inspect the starter clutch , or he can buy a new starter and see if that works first . I've tore mine apart so many times , so I'd inspect the starter clutch since I can do it and have it back together in 30 mins . but in his case , I'd prob buy a new starter since they are cheap and see if that solves the issue.
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Post by geh3333 on Dec 26, 2015 7:20:28 GMT -5
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Post by geh3333 on Dec 26, 2015 7:10:51 GMT -5
Do not tune the CVT so the rpms pass redline !! These engines redline at 8k and are known to cook themselves. Your power band is closer to 7500 rpms on a stock engine . if you can reach 7500 rpms on a straight run your pretty much set. I consider myself an expert when it comes to tuning these cvts. I've posted vids of my blue beast running at 67mph on straight runs and 76 mph down medium hills , and I still never exceeded 8k rpm. And yes that's GPS mph . my takeoff rpms usually would rise to around 7k , hen slightly drop off while the mph climbs. Eventally the rpms rise again and top out near 7500 rpms on a straight run and around 8k down hill. I would never have my takeoff rpms reach 8k or over , however 8200 rpms down hill will not hurt anything, but if your able to hit 8200 rpms on a straight run , then your gonna be near 9k down hill !! Which is never good for a stock setup .
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Post by geh3333 on Dec 25, 2015 19:00:42 GMT -5
Inside the clutch assembly, where the 3 springs are located? When u pull the clutch from the drive shaft , u grease inside the bearings that come into contact with the shaft . also when u remove the torque spring , u pop off the inner cover that the spring rides on and grease the slots. |
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Post by geh3333 on Dec 25, 2015 18:55:39 GMT -5
I switched the variators I was using. I am using the DLH variator now, and I will update on how it is holding up. When I say the rails sheered off, they sheered off. I don't know if the guides broke first, or not. They sheered off right at the edge of the "wall" on the variator, so they were even with the "wall". I will post a link to the belts I have been getting lately. I cannot find a Gates "premium" belt in the 729 size, just the standard Gates. I have a 52mm BBK, and a regular belt will snap in there in a couple of days. I found these belts on ebay, and when you hold them, and compare them to regular belts, they just appear to be such a better quality. Performance, especially top speed, is increased greatly with these, also. RPM at top speed is 1500 RPM less with these than with a standard Gates belt. Anyways, here is the link to the belt. www.ebay.com/itm/KEVLAR-729-17-7-30-PREMIUM-CVT-DRIVE-BELT-GY6-49CC-50CC-139QMB-LONG-CASE-BELT-/271082023182?hash=item3f1dbf690e:g:n1UAAOSwo6lWMBu7Wow your metal guides broke off completely ? I would def pay attention t the new one. If it happened again I would possibly replace the tranny bearings ! That was the issue I had . |
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Post by geh3333 on Dec 25, 2015 18:52:44 GMT -5
He can bypass the solenoid and connect a car battery directly to the starter and see what happens . if the same thing happens then its either the starter or the st clutch . he can then try a new starter and if it does not work then its the starter clutch . very simple.
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Post by geh3333 on Dec 25, 2015 18:48:24 GMT -5
At this point he has covered everything but the head , the starter , the solenoid and the starter clutch . of course you would start at the solenoid , then the starter , then the starter clutch . but the head is out of the question . even if you believe he has low compression , that would never cause the starter to seem weak . so the issue is in the starter area . remember rcq is right when he said that u cannot ge a compression reading with the starter not turning the engine over.
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Post by geh3333 on Dec 25, 2015 18:44:09 GMT -5
i know this, a defective starter clutch would be at the very far end of my list of causes for starter drag, if it was on there at all. That's because you never had it happen . I've seen it happen more than once . and if you read the thread he is at the end of the list now. |
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Post by geh3333 on Dec 25, 2015 18:41:37 GMT -5
Another thing to consider is that he already replaced the cylinder , piston and rings , so what's left ? Its not seized up .its doing the same with the new cylinder and piston . the valves are opening so its not that . the whole point is that it could be a few different things. I think he already wasted money , but only time will tell.
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Post by geh3333 on Dec 25, 2015 18:35:01 GMT -5
Just like a high compression engine would cause the starter to be too weak to turn it over . the broken starter clutch slowed the starter before it caught and therefore it was too weak when it finally grabbed the crank.
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