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Post by w650 on Jan 10, 2017 20:12:41 GMT -5
The Germans built their tanks with Swiss watch like precision. The Russians on the other hand, (having made a Study that found a active combat vehicle had a life expectancy of about three weeks) turned them out crudely finished but serviceable, and in overwhelming numbers. Since as you say most will be sold before the tires need replacing, superb quality in a scoot is unnecessary.
The 49cc QMB is a crude, simple motor with an incredible service life. While most Chinese versions lack sophistication in suspension and many other features they will do the job for short distance work in Urban and Tourist centers. It's simply the reason why the other manufacturers are on the ropes against them.
Many of the Chinese bikes are sold in short time after purchase because the owners get tired of them quickly however you more often see Piaggio riders hanging on to them for many years or trading up.
The Chinese scooter owners are buying them as starter bikes. That short time is how long they need to decide, in many cases, to buy a motorcycle. Piaggio owners are usually devoted to the idea of a scooter so they, along with purchasers of other large scooters, (Honda, Yamaha, Suzuki, BMW) buy what they perceive as the best brand for extended use.
Horses for courses.
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Post by w650 on Jan 9, 2017 13:59:20 GMT -5
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Post by w650 on Jan 9, 2017 7:38:03 GMT -5
All very interesting but here are the facts. The scooter market right now is selling 65% of their product in the 50cc size range. The Chinese are pretty much controlling that market. The people who buy those scooters don't care that it says Aprilia, Piaggio, Honda, Vespa or Yamaha on the flanks. What they care about is that they can walk into a small shop and pick one up for a Grand as opposed to two grand or more. As we have seen, most new scooter owners aren't enthusiasts. They're frustrated giant SUV owners who are trying to escape big gas bills at the pump. Name means little to most.
The sales of MIC members in the scooter division has been in a nose dive since 2008. Vespa shops close daily, Piaggio sized scooters peak at the BV 350, which is a 330cc, and the Japanese come and go with larger sized scooters. Honda builds the Metropolitan in China so it can keep the price around Two Grand. Yamaha has entered into an agreement to co-manufacture scooters with Honda. There hasn't been a new model introduced in years among any of the big names.
I won't say much more than this. In the 1960s the Japanese came here and created a huge motorcycle market. Since 1946 the scooter market here has been small with smoky, cranky scooters from Europe holding sway for decades and remember that Piaggio abandoned the market from 1980 to 2000 altogether. The Chinese are taking the small scooter market by a storm and putting people on scooter saddles. Calling them junk or cheap Chinese crap is going to have the same effect as Harley owners calling our bikes "Rice Burners". None. Bang for the buck always holds importance for the American buyer and if those 50cc scooters only last three years that will satisfy millions of buyers. Most will probably sell them before the first tire change anyway.
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Post by w650 on Jan 6, 2017 14:53:40 GMT -5
I'd like to think you could say they're doing the work. If you dig through the forums from 2008 when I started playing with a Chinese scooter you would see the difference. Carbs clogged from decaying fuel lines, tire valves blowing out of rims at a moments notice, vacuum lines falling off because they dried out and endless complaints about electrical issues. Not to mention cheap meal breaking in the strangest ways. The complaints here now are tame by comparison. Also keep in mind that there are thousands of people out there riding China scoots that don't do forums. Bintelli posted a picture on Facebook of a customer who owns a 50cc model with 21,000 miles. All of them done in a year. I'm guessing there are numerous high mileage Chinese scooters out there we don't know about.  |
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Post by w650 on Jan 6, 2017 14:30:52 GMT -5
I'm glad it all worked out for you.
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Post by w650 on Jan 6, 2017 8:41:57 GMT -5
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Post by w650 on Jan 4, 2017 7:13:11 GMT -5
If it's under warranty don't even think about it. Take it to the Dealer. That's why you paid the money instead of buying something online. If it's a defect they'll fix it under the terms of the warranty. If not, you're just doing what you have to do to maintain that warranty against a possible bigger future problem. If you have to take it back later for something and they see a non-standard belt you could run into a problem.
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my bike
by: w650 - Dec 30, 2016 14:22:40 GMT -5
Post by w650 on Dec 30, 2016 14:22:40 GMT -5
It varies. I will refer to my scooters as "The black scooter" or "The blue scooter" for my wife or as a "bike" depending on my mood. I never say "Moped" for any of them.
Sorry to hear the scooter is disabled. Better days are coming.
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Post by w650 on Dec 27, 2016 7:10:36 GMT -5
Oh I agree. But I'm wondering when sooner or later the Chinese "get it" (by being around major Western manufacturers and following their example if nothing else) and evolving like Hyundai did.
I'm only hoping that if they "Get It" it doesn't drive the prices up like it did Korean materials. Hyosung scooters and motorcycles, Hyundai and Kia autos cost in the same neighborhood as their Japanese counterparts. I bought a Scion iA in June after pricing comparable Kia and Hyundai. With the options I had standard in the Scion both brands came in about a thousand more.
A 50cc Bintelli or Wolf comes in cheaper than a Kymco or SYM and will last just as long. I'm not so sure the Chinese don't get it. People here with common sense have gotten extraordinary service out of Chinese scooters.
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Post by w650 on Dec 24, 2016 21:28:35 GMT -5
What I'm going to find interesting is when Benelli bikes are penetrating the market. The Chinese will be using the designs of Italian engineers, modifying the designs to meet available metallurgy and production capabilities and sending the product off to the world. It will be even more interesting to see if the bikes are perceived as Italian or Chinese by the masses.
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Post by w650 on Dec 23, 2016 8:53:51 GMT -5
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Post by w650 on Dec 22, 2016 13:10:39 GMT -5
This was the first article I read about CCW. www.cycleworld.com/2011/01/28/cleveland-cycle-werks-heist-riding-impressionThe strength of this engine jumped out at me when I read this. Colosimo dropped off two Heists at our offices, each with 4 kilometers showing on their metric odometers, and encouraged us to flog away. Break-in period? Not so much. Colosimo says he’s put 100,000 miles on three test Heists, along with FEA and stress-testing of all sorts of components.
That kind of reliability can't be ignored. Imagine spending $2k on a Chinese online motorcycle and seeing that kind of mileage. Almost free money. |
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Post by w650 on Dec 22, 2016 9:25:34 GMT -5
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Post by w650 on Dec 22, 2016 9:02:32 GMT -5
In these parts of New York the use of salt is quite heavy in Winter. Even my cheap bikes deserve better than being dissolved from corrosion. I generally won't take them out until a few rains have washed away the salt.
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Post by w650 on Dec 21, 2016 16:17:00 GMT -5
These are Honda CG-250 clone motors, probably from Lifan. If they look familiar, they should. Scott Colosimo installs these engines in his CPI built Cleveland Cyclewerks line at $3500. Colosimo had his bikes not only EPA certified but CARB approved. This engine is a push rod, two valve motor designed for worst case conditions in the Third World and probably will never wear out in the right hands. This engine is also powering numerous inexpensive Dual Purpose and Road bikes from online sellers for under $2k. www.powersportsmax.com/product_info.php/cPath/482/products_id/20540en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cleveland_CycleWerks |
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