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Post by lain on Feb 7, 2015 6:59:27 GMT -5
So I have had some trouble in the past when I installed the BBK the first time. I finally got a new kit and should be ready to install it anytime now! I just want some clarification on some stuff so I feel more confident about what I am doing.
Details: Same scoot, jonway agility yy50qt-6. 50mm Big bore kit. It appears the parts of my big bore kit are made by "Growsun" is this a good manufacturer?
When installing the rings, what do I gap the oil rings to? I can't find anything on gapping oil rings. How do I install the oil rings and the wavy ring?
I am pretty sure I know how to gap my compression rings, however I welcome any corrections so I can better understand! This time the compression rings actually both arrived at 0.007 I am thinking I might just leave them like that since I was planning to gap them to just under 0.008 or as close under as I could.
On the matter of rings, how do I position ALL of them? I keep getting guides to tell me how to position compression rings but nothing about oil rings, a lot of guides I found just leave out oil rings...
I am thinking this is why I had so much trouble with my current installed BBK, because I didn't know much about the rings and stuff and had to keep reopening stuff the first time.
Also, is there any risk or any complications with doing the BBK installation in below freezing temperatures? Like maybe the gaskets wont seal right? I'm thinking of building myself a tent out of tarps and work on my scoot this afternoon. The tent will block out snow but yeah it's still gonna be cold as heck on a Sunday!
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Post by JoeyBee on Feb 7, 2015 9:22:00 GMT -5
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Post by lain on Feb 7, 2015 9:53:16 GMT -5
Yeah that is the guide I used the first time, which is why I am confused. The only thing is says about the oil rings is; |
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Post by JoeyBee on Feb 7, 2015 10:20:19 GMT -5
I'll try to find that video. It explained all the rings very well. It was a member from the forum. He also drew the lines on the piston to ensure the gaps were separated. I think the marker was blue if that helps anyone to remember.
I forgot to ask, but since you will being installing a new kit. Does that mean your scooter is still eating oil, smoking, and popping?
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Post by jerseyboy on Feb 7, 2015 10:27:39 GMT -5
I'll try to find that video. It explained all the rings very well. It was a member from the forum. He also drew the lines on the piston to ensure the gaps were separated. I think the marker was blue if that helps anyone to remember. I forgot to ask, but since you will being installing a new kit. Does that mean your scooter is still eating oil, smoking, and popping? That was me Joey!! Its for a 150 but same method... |
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Post by lain on Feb 7, 2015 10:28:10 GMT -5
I'll try to find that video. It explained all the rings very well. It was a member from the forum. He also drew the lines on the piston to ensure the gaps were separated. I think the marker was blue if that helps anyone to remember. I forgot to ask, but since you will being installing a new kit. Does that mean your scooter is still eating oil, smoking, and popping? Not popping, but it is eating oil and smoking. The smoke is blue. I would like to install this kit and know what to do with the oil rings this time. I feel my problems with the last kit with it still smoking and spewing out oil is all related to me not knowing what to do with the oil rings. All the guides I find focus on the compression rings, but I feel like there's something critical I am missing here with the oil rings. |
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Post by lain on Feb 7, 2015 10:31:18 GMT -5
I'll try to find that video. It explained all the rings very well. It was a member from the forum. He also drew the lines on the piston to ensure the gaps were separated. I think the marker was blue if that helps anyone to remember. I forgot to ask, but since you will being installing a new kit. Does that mean your scooter is still eating oil, smoking, and popping? That was me Joey!! Its for a 150 but same pricaple... Great guide on positioning ALL of the rings! Now what about gaps or they do not matter at all on oil rings? |
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Post by JoeyBee on Feb 7, 2015 10:31:52 GMT -5
jerseyboy. That's the one. And you did a very good job with the explanation. Best I have seen.
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Post by jerseyboy on Feb 7, 2015 10:34:34 GMT -5
jerseyboy. That's the one. And you did a very good job with the explanation. Best I have seen. Thanks man! Im not much of a speaker or video maker but I figured I would share my research with others,,the motor is together and running strong! |
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Post by lain on Feb 7, 2015 10:38:02 GMT -5
Do gaps on oil rings not matter? It looks like one of my oil rings does not have a gap at all when in the cylinder.
Also, I noticed in the BBK install guide it says for the top and bottom compression rings to be different sizes, but the Gy6 manual suggests both compression rings be the same size. Is there any reason for this?
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Post by jerseyboy on Feb 7, 2015 10:43:33 GMT -5
My oil rings where about .008 on both so I just put them in like they came,,yours should be fine at .007.
Alot of people,,even scrappy don't even check for ring end gap on these GY6 motors,,IMO thats wrong,,they should be set to the correct gap..especially with a the compression these little motors have.I know after break in they open up a hair,,so if you set them on the tight side thats cool.
But hey,,if you want to trust the guy at the Asian factory/machine shop that made them,,more power to ya...mine where actually a bit to tight at .007 and .008 for a 150 1 1/2" down into the top bore.
Make sure you check it at least 1 1/2" down in on both sides of the bore,,they say the top of the bore is always a little tighter than the bottom.I should have measured that but didnt know until I put mine in.
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Post by lain on Feb 7, 2015 10:56:10 GMT -5
My oil rings where about .008 on both so I just put them in like they came,,yours should be fine at .007. Alot of people,,even scrappy don't even check for ring end gap on these GY6 motors,,IMO thats wrong,,they should be set to the correct gap..especially with a the compression these little motors have.I know after break in they open up a hair,,so if you set them on the tight side thats cool. But hey,,if you want to trust the guy at the Asian factory/machine shop that made them,,more power to ya...mine where actually a bit to tight at .007 and .008 for a 150 1 1/2" down into the top bore. Make sure you check it at least 1 1/2" down in on both sides of the bore,,they say the top of the bore is always a little tighter than the bottom.I should have measured that but didnt know until I put mine in. I checked my rings halfway down the cylinder. Like, I put the piston in and let it go all the way to the bottom, then i put the ring in the cylinder and pushed it as close to the piston i could, then I pushed the piston up from the bottom to level the ring out in the cylinder at the middle, then I used feeler gauges and measured the gaps. I like to check everything now and make sure everything is as it should be. I do not want to have to take my BBK apart after installing it a dozen times again. I want to get it right this install and then not ever have to crack it open again. |
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Post by rcq92130 on Feb 7, 2015 13:13:36 GMT -5
Just a thought:
Clocking the oil rings, though preferable, is not all that critical (they are not there to hold high compression). Most times when a new install ends up not well - burning oil - it's because the flimsy oil rings were damaged when the piston was pushed up into the jug. Not that hard to get them twisted and bent.
Suggest you get a stainless clamp to compress them BEFORE to slide the piston up into the jug. And suggest you get a tube of assembly lube. Well oiled is a somewhat weak substitute. And just go slow and be gentle. If you get cold, stop, go inside to warm up, then come back. Most errors happen when we are tired or otherwise not at the top of our game.
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Post by jerseyboy on Feb 7, 2015 13:25:07 GMT -5
I would make sure the oil rings have a gap if I was you,,if they are touching eachother while the motor is cold,,wait till it gets hot,,they will start to bind and score,,maybe even break..get the proper gap for those as well,,do the math that I posted in my BBK thread to find out what they should be at.Better safe then sorry...
My compression rings looked different sizes but after I checked them with a caliper I found out they are the same size,,just different colors..they should be marked on the top with a T,T1,T2 ect.....T or T1 goes on top...
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Post by JerryScript on Feb 7, 2015 14:26:50 GMT -5
I agree, it only takes a few minutes to properly gap them, so why not do it right. And yes, half way down the jug is a good position to check them at.
I also agree that a ring clamp is the best way to get the piston into the jug without messing up the rings. That taper is really not enough to ensure the rings don't bind or twist during installation without compressing them with a clamp. I did my BBK without a ring clamp, and it took me 20 minutes to get them in safely, mostly because of the awkward positioning you have to get in when working on the engine inside the frame.
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