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Post by oldhippie on Oct 30, 2014 22:57:39 GMT -5
Got a basket case '08 JMSTAR 250 recently and want to see if the engine runs before I spend more time and bucks on the thing. Only has 1100 miles on it, but the Dufus who I bought it from thought he had a wiring problem and so he removed ALL OF IT so he could re-wire it...Didn't happen. So I came along and changed out a clutch for him on his Rebel and he GAVE me the scoot for my labor. So, I need to know what wires I need to hook up so I can see if it will start and run. I have changed all fluids, cleaned everything and connected a battery so I could momentarily tap the large wire on top of the solenoid to hear it crank, which it does. I am not new to scooters and this isn't my first rodeo, however, if someone could be so kind and can tell me which wires to connect to which components, that would be super, or, I can take some photos to show the wires that were left on the scooter that are hooked up to which of the components, (CDI, Regulator, coil, etc.) and which are not. Hope someone can show me which components I have to "hot wire" to get it to run.
One other thing, there is a switch on the throttle side above the starter switch that looks almost like a turn signal switch but it's not, and I cannot figure out what it does??? I'm sure someone knows the answer. Would appreciate it.
Thanks from the Old Hippie |
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Post by wilds on Oct 31, 2014 0:24:18 GMT -5
A picture would help a lot when trying to help you...
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Post by scooter on Oct 31, 2014 0:32:41 GMT -5
Hope someone can show me which components I have to "hot wire" to get it to run.
One other thing, there is a switch on the throttle side above the starter switch that looks almost like a turn signal switch but it's not, and I cannot figure out what it does??? I'm sure someone knows the answer. Would appreciate it.
Thanks from the Old Hippie Mine has a switch on the right for the lights. OFF/RUNNING/ON Here is a nice test bench with easy to read wiring. Very simple.  Thanks to Bashan from scooterdoc scooterdoc.proboards.com/thread/6884/gy6-project?page=3 and for Alleyoop for sending us to see it. You can hook the starter button/solenoid to your regular battery. He said he hooked his up this way for some reason having to do with convenience. |
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Post by alleyoop on Oct 31, 2014 1:01:08 GMT -5
Here is a Video By Rich Owner of ScooterDoc he made a Motor Bench Test setup which you can do just as easly.
Alleyoop
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Post by oldhippie on Oct 31, 2014 9:52:07 GMT -5
Absolutely outstanding! What a help these suggestions will be to see if this thing will run. Thank you so much, guys, for your replies to my needs. That's what I love about this group of scooter loving humans... you all want to help each other no matter what it is. For us who love to tinker and DIY, this is an invaluable wealth of knowledge to dip from. Thanks and I will get back with an update when I get this thing wired to run. Later, Old Hippie
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Post by oldhippie on Nov 3, 2014 9:48:55 GMT -5
Update on wiring engine to start...Well, I got everything hooked up as demonstrated on the video you suggested that I watch, however, with the plug out and it grounded to the frame, no spark! UGH! So I began searching for ways to test the coil, CDI and the stator. I have found ways to test the coil with a VOM, but, so far, I have not found any methods to test the CDI, so I put a good spare CDI (new) in place and still no spark. Also tried it with a good spare coil with the same results. All this was done with a new, fully charged battery and a new plug. In a day or so, I will recheck the wiring that I did to see if I did it correctly. Also, rather than using the two 6v batteries to activate the solenoid, I went directly to the scooter 12v battery, and the cranking/starter circuit worked just fine. It seems there is no method that I have found in my search to test the stator without the engine running. I am just not an electrical whiz at all, but I do know plus from minus, so if anyone can help me with this, I would appreciate it so much. Thanks for your help, The Old Hippie
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Post by alleyoop on Nov 3, 2014 12:37:27 GMT -5
Ok make sure you have a Ground wire from the negative post to the frame and a ground wire from the motor to the grame.
Both have to be grounded to the frame. Also when you check for spark ALWAYS check for spark ON the motor. Reason being is it may spark on the frame but not the motor which would mean the motor is not grounded.
Alleyoop
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Post by oldhippie on Nov 3, 2014 21:04:12 GMT -5
Alleyoop, you are so right about good grounding. You are spot on with that! I messed around with a lot of early VW's and I learned really fast that is the FIRST thing one always does is to make sure all is grounded well.
I have one point on the scooter frame (that I sanded and put white grease on) where all the grounding wires are attached...One from the engine and one from the negative side of the battery, so I think everything is grounded well here. As far as the plug goes, I hooked a heavy wire with heavy duty clips from the threaded part of the plug to the ground terminal I was talking about above, and the plug wire attached the top of the plug...still no spark.
I have been pretty busy with other priorities and will not be able to resume my troubleshooting for a day or two, so please be patient with me...You know how life can get in the way of our hobbies.
One other thing that I have a question about are the colors of the wires coming from my stator which differ from the Scooter Doc video. Of course, there are the three yellow wires that don't matter in this situation, however, where the video from Scooter Doc Rich shows a red and a light blue wire from the stator on his engine, mine are dark blue and green. Does it matter how they are hooked to the CDI? One wire goes to the 4-plug and one to the 2-plug on the CDI, so I have been attaching the wires to the same locations on the plugs as my colors differ here also. Is there a polarity priority here or is this important in the attaching of these two wires? Thanks
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Post by alleyoop on Nov 3, 2014 22:41:23 GMT -5
Very easy to determine which wire FROM THE STATOR goes where on the CDI. Find the wire coming from the PICKUP COIL by the stator and that goes on the 4 plug TOP LEFT . Now the Green wire might just be that a GROUND green for the stator.
Question: On the CDI's TWO plug is there a wire already on the bottom of the two plug ? If so just ground the green wire to the frame. The CDI should then have most likely 1 bottom wire on the two plug TWO wires on the two top on the 4 plug and 1 or two green wires on the two bottom of the 4 plug.
Alleyoop
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Post by oldhippie on Nov 4, 2014 12:06:37 GMT -5
Ok, on this scooter, if you refer to the position of the CDI in the video from Scooter Doc, the wire colors and pin locations are as follows. On the 4-plug, top left is red and white; top right is yellow and black'; bottom right is green and nothing in bottom left. On the 2-plug, the top wire is black and white, and bottom wire is solid black. I looked at the CDI on my old Tank and the only difference from it and the Jmstar is the bottom wire on the 2-plug is red and black. So, if your term "pick up coil" is the same as the coil hanging from the bottom of the top frame tubing on the "driver's side" of the scoot, the two wires there are green and black/white. The top left on the 4plug on the CDI is red and white. And the two wires that go into the stator area are blue and green, along with the yellow wires that come from the same location. This gets kinda gets confusing because, on this scoot, I think it's one of the ones that the factory must have run out of a certain color of wire, and rather than stopping production to get more wire, they just substituted another wire while the right color was on order. There are a number of plugs on this thing where the wires change colors at a plug. Oh well, I will just have to deal with it. I really think that after this problem is solved I will wire the thing the correct way and NOT the way it was wired at the factory. Hope the information I have given you just doesn't confuse you...questions, let me know. The Old Hippie
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Post by oldhippie on Nov 14, 2014 13:55:36 GMT -5
I finally am getting some time to return to my scooter problem which is no spark. I ordered a new coil and CDI to see if this move would eliminate the problem but to no avail. I have wired this thing using all the info in the videos above and switched appropriate wires around just to see if this would change anything and still no spark. And there are no fuses in the wiring. So I hooked my vom directly to the two wires coming from the pick up coil (blue and green on this one) and cranked it over. I tried both AC and DC modes but no indication of anything on the meter. And, yes, the meter has good batteries and works fine. Sooooo...Does this mean I have to replace the stator or are there other ways of testing the stator before I have to tear into it or what. Any new ideas? I would appreciate any help with this. Do you need photos of what I have here? Let me know. And, Alleyoop, you have been most helpful with this and I do thank you for your efforts! The Old Hippie
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Post by alleyoop on Nov 14, 2014 14:47:49 GMT -5
Here is a good Video on how to check the electrical parts. Now what may be the problem is that scoot may be a DC setup which would mean that the BOTTOM WIRE on the 2 PLUG needs 12volts when the key is turned on. Also I would recommend to having a fuse on the wire going to the IGNITION. Also which solenoid does the scoot have #1 or #2? Alleyoop #1  #2  GOOD VID TO TEST FOR NO SPARK: |
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Post by oldhippie on Nov 14, 2014 16:46:40 GMT -5
This scoot has the #1 style solenoid, however, the replacement coil that I ordered is a #2. I thought I could just put a female 2-prong plug on it and use it. The way I temp wired this one is by hooking up a heavy duty starter button (I used for automobiles) to the two poles on top of the solenoid with the "in" red wire to the solenoid going to the positive side of the battery and the negative from the scooter to the negative side of the battery. So I basically bypassed the solenoid to crank it by using the HD start button. I am going to look at the video now and see if I can learn anything. Also, I do not understand why nothing is being produced by the two stator wires when I crank it. As you can tell, they did not call me "sparky" back in the day. And just as a reminder, the original wiring harness is in a basket. Thanks, The Old Hippie
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Post by alleyoop on Nov 14, 2014 17:25:45 GMT -5
Well TWO wires are important to test if the Electrical producer STATOR is working or not. 1. The Wire coming from the STATOR that plugs into the BOTTOM WIRE on the TWO PLUG to POWER THE CDI. 2. The Wire coming from the PICKUP COIL that plugs into the LEFT TOP of the 4 plug on the CDI that tells the CDI to release the VOLTAGE and send it to the COIL to FEED THE SPARK PLUG. So check out what I labeled on this CDI, if either of just those two wires are not producing then NO SPARK. Alleyoop CLICK ON THE PICTURE TO EXPAND IT SO YOU CAN READ IT BETTER:  |
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..BAD TO THE BONE..