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Post by dmartin95 on Aug 22, 2014 21:17:08 GMT -5
Hi all, I was wondering if someone could share some light on a few things for me. First, I would like some general info about stator's. It appears to be the case that some scooters use DC, some AC and others even use a combination of both, AC and DC. First thing I am wondering about is the difference in poles/coils. Does more poles mean that it can generate more electricity? What lead me to this line of question is a few things. I was wanting to add a cigarette lighter/12V power port to my new Scooter (Bintelli Havoc 150cc). I also was wanting to add (or replace with HID) an additional head lamp for my wife's BMS Heritage 150cc. Now, I have been able to locate the wiring diagram for BMS Heritage, however my new havoc, the files are no where to be found. I think the Bintelli Havoc has a 12 pole DC stator. However, I can't find no way to verify this without digging into the engine because there is no parts diagram for the Havoc (There is a parts diagram on Bintellis website, but the diagram has no engine information at all). All I want to know about this Havoc is how much power can the 12 pole stator produce? Also, does anyone have a parts Diagram for the Bintelli Havoc 150cc engine? It is engine model BN157QMJ. I believe it's manufactured by ZNEN. My wifes BMS Heritage; her light "flickers" and is not very bright. With the highs on I have about a 25 ft viewing area and it flickers way too much. Not to the point of a strobe, but very annoying none the less. I have no idea what Stator this scooter has but if anyone else knows, I would love for you to share. Also, I would love it if anyone knew how many watts the Heritage stator can produce? Thank you for any advice you can share! Read more: 49ccscoot.proboards.com/thread/9870/seeking-manuals-wiring-diagrams-stators#ixzz3BB4cUJco |
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Post by bashan on Aug 23, 2014 0:54:34 GMT -5
I can answer a few of your questions. Most scooter electrical systems are a combination of AC and DC. Some of the lights are DC and come on with the key such as the tail light. Some are AC and come on when the stator starts spinning. These stators have the white wire that is dedicate to the charging circuit, and the yellow AC wire that is center tapped on the white wire. They also have a magneto coil that supplies AC to the AC CDI:
The white terminates in the R/R and does not split off. The Yellow splits and supplies AC current to many of the lights around the bike. But you may have a three phase DC system in which the stator has three yellows that run to the R/R. The DC output of the R/R supplies the entire bike and everything essentially runs off of the battery including the DC CDI:
Some three phase stators have a magneto coil and it supplies AC to the CDI. So how do you tell?
If your stator has a white, yellow, and green wire in the pigtail, and then a red/black and a blue/white wire, it is an AC system with mostly AC lights and an AC CDI. Some of the lights are DC as mandated by the DOT.
If the stator has three yellows and no red/black, it is a pure DC system and the CDI is DC fired.
If the stator has three yellows but also a red/black, the system is all DC except for the CDI which will be AC fired. It gets a little confusing. |
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Post by tvnacman on Aug 23, 2014 7:15:53 GMT -5
keep in mind "stators" only generate ac voltage not dc !!!! What happens after the stator is determined by external components and or wiring configurations . Now there is a thread here where a 12pole stator and a dc cdi configuration was from the factory and the charging system was too weak . We went to an 11pole stator and 7pin regulator , that brought the charging system near perfect . It was tested with dc cdi trouble free . The 11pole stator has an ac coil for ignition now there are options to use dc or ac cdi .
If you have questions about this feel free to call or post further questions here .
John
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Post by dmartin95 on Aug 23, 2014 17:49:27 GMT -5
keep in mind "stators" only generate ac voltage not dc !!!! What happens after the stator is determined by external components and or wiring configurations . Hi thanks for the responses.... I did not know that Stators only generate AC electricity. I found some specs on the stator that is in the Bintelli Havoc: Znen GY6 150cc Scooter 12-coil Stator DC Current (29mm center hole diameter, 42mm diagonal bolt hole spacing)
--------------- However it does not list how many watts its capable of producing. Also, why does it say DC current if they only generate A/C? Does anyone know how many watts this 12 pole stator is rated for?  |
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Post by tvnacman on Aug 23, 2014 19:37:57 GMT -5
none of the electrical parts in the chinese scooter world have spec listings .
John
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Post by bashan on Aug 24, 2014 0:36:40 GMT -5
John is 100% correct, a stator by definition only creates AC current. As the magnets approach the coils they push the electrons one way:
When the pass they create the opposite flow of electrons:
Together they give you the classic AC current waveform:
That is AC current plain and simple. If it was creating DC current it would be a generator and the mechanism of action there is completely different. If they said it was a DC stator that is wrong, there is no such thing. They may have meant that it was a three phase stator that converted all of it's AC energy to DC via the R/R and then everything including the CDI ran off of DC. A stator produces AC energy and scooters do not have generators. Rich |
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Post by dmartin95 on Aug 24, 2014 0:49:11 GMT -5
Even if they're not published, someone on these forums has to have thrown a multimeter or ammeter on these stators. I was really hoping someone on this forum has a BN157QMJ and ran some test on it.
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Post by JR on Aug 25, 2014 21:57:21 GMT -5
keep in mind "stators" only generate ac voltage not dc !!!! What happens after the stator is determined by external components and or wiring configurations . Hi thanks for the responses.... I did not know that Stators only generate AC electricity. I found some specs on the stator that is in the Bintelli Havoc: Znen GY6 150cc Scooter 12-coil Stator DC Current (29mm center hole diameter, 42mm diagonal bolt hole spacing)
--------------- However it does not list how many watts its capable of producing. Also, why does it say DC current if they only generate A/C? Does anyone know how many watts this 12 pole stator is rated for? Reason it's listed as Dc is simple, so many people post things that are incorrect it's not funny. If that is the stator for the Bintelli then it is AC with 3 wires to the R/R and a single pulse coil wire along with a ground. Also people get the charging system mixed up with the ignition system (CDI) in this case along with your BMS you have a Dc type CDI because they feed from the battery.
No diagrams on the Havoc or any other Bintelli scooters at this moment in fact they only have one owners manual for all of their models with no wiring diagram so the only way to verify your assumption of the 12 pole stator is to actually open it up, if you have 3 yellows going to the R/R from the stator it's 3 phase but could be 11, 12 or in rare cases a 18 pole stator on a 150 scooter.
Now as far as your wife's scooter flickering indicates a poor connection or bad wire and the diagram for this scooter also says 3-phase so it should have ample charging and lighting capabilities.
As far as meter readings, on either scooter if they were out there I would know, wattage ratings? Figures vary everywhere. So it would be nice for someone to step up to the podium and do a diagnostic measuring of both scooters and fill everyone in on what is in these scooters and what the electrical system puts out.
I elect you. 
JR
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Post by dmartin95 on Aug 26, 2014 15:00:53 GMT -5
Hi JR, Thanks for the informative reply. The reason that I'm making the assumption that it's a 12 pole stator isn't just a WAG  ... When I was searching for specs and wiring diagrams, many sellers had the same 12 pole stator and specifically list it for the 150cc Bintelli Havoc.... But at this point, I have not verified it yet. It's a bummer no one has published the specs for these stators. I would've thought with all the people upgrading their lights to HID's (xenon gas) that someone would've thought to see how much power they have. While I don't want to upgrade my lights, I would like to add a dual port cigarette lighter to my scooter to power my GPS, an illuminated tachometer, Ride on Camera and be able to charge my phone. Most of my devices only draw about 1 amp and I will not be using more than two at a time. But even still, that's right around 25 watts and I'm not sure if the scooter has that much to spare. As far as being elected, I will take that nomination once I get time. I can test three different 150cc Models. My Bintelli Havoc, BMS Heritage and a DongFang, Sunny. I will try and get a good bench-top reading as they will be skewed in the scooter due to lights and various other components creating a draw on the stator. I've learned quite a bit about stators lately. It's funny actually, I thought they were DC generators and didn't even realize how they worked. I have a fair understanding of electrical engineering and will pick this up pretty quickly I'm thinking... As long as I have you fine folk to fall back on, that is.... But I will test these stators and publish their results. Most likely once it gets too cold to ride..... Hopefully in the mean time someone else will test and publish their scoots. It would be nice to have big database covering a wide variety scooters. |
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Post by dmartin95 on Sept 3, 2014 2:25:57 GMT -5
Now as far as your wife's scooter flickering indicates a poor connection or bad wire and the diagram for this scooter also says 3-phase so it should have ample charging and lighting capabilities.
I elect you.
JR
I figured out what it was tonight (by accident at that). I was going to install a cigarette lighter port and when I looked at the battery cables, I noticed the square nut in the battery terminal that the bolt goes into was missing. The bolt was just sitting on top of the negative terminal. There was nothing securing the negative cable at all. In addition, the Positive battery screw was slightly loose. Secured the ground and positive nice and tight and the flicker is gone. In addition, the headlamp is twice as bright! |
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Post by JR on Sept 3, 2014 8:12:05 GMT -5
Now as far as your wife's scooter flickering indicates a poor connection or bad wire and the diagram for this scooter also says 3-phase so it should have ample charging and lighting capabilities.
I elect you.
JR
I figured out what it was tonight (by accident at that). I was going to install a cigarette lighter port and when I looked at the battery cables, I noticed the square nut in the battery terminal that the bolt goes into was missing. The bolt was just sitting on top of the negative terminal. There was nothing securing the negative cable at all. In addition, the Positive battery screw was slightly loose. Secured the ground and positive nice and tight and the flicker is gone. In addition, the headlamp is twice as bright!
Never fails and good job! 
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Post by dmartin95 on Sept 3, 2014 10:16:20 GMT -5
Thank you!
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Post by dmartin95 on Nov 5, 2014 13:56:43 GMT -5
To bring closure to this thread.... I have verified that the Bintelli Havoc 150cc has a 12-pole stator/magneto that is DC (CDI) fired, it produces 120watts at 7500 rpm.
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Post by suckaphish on Sept 3, 2016 0:50:01 GMT -5
Hi all, I was wondering if someone could share some light on a few things for me. First, I would like some general info about stator's. It appears to be the case that some scooters use DC, some AC and others even use a combination of both, AC and DC. First thing I am wondering about is the difference in poles/coils. Does more poles mean that it can generate more electricity? What lead me to this line of question is a few things. I was wanting to add a cigarette lighter/12V power port to my new Scooter (Bintelli Havoc 150cc). I also was wanting to add (or replace with HID) an additional head lamp for my wife's BMS Heritage 150cc. Now, I have been able to locate the wiring diagram for BMS Heritage, however my new havoc, the files are no where to be found. I think the Bintelli Havoc has a 12 pole DC stator. However, I can't find no way to verify this without digging into the engine because there is no parts diagram for the Havoc (There is a parts diagram on Bintellis website, but the diagram has no engine information at all). All I want to know about this Havoc is how much power can the 12 pole stator produce? Also, does anyone have a parts Diagram for the Bintelli Havoc 150cc engine? It is engine model BN157QMJ. I believe it's manufactured by ZNEN. My wifes BMS Heritage; her light "flickers" and is not very bright. With the highs on I have about a 25 ft viewing area and it flickers way too much. Not to the point of a strobe, but very annoying none the less. I have no idea what Stator this scooter has but if anyone else knows, I would love for you to share. Also, I would love it if anyone knew how many watts the Heritage stator can produce? Thank you for any advice you can share! Read more: 49ccscoot.proboards.com/thread/9870/seeking-manuals-wiring-diagrams-stators#ixzz3BB4cUJco |
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Post by suckaphish on Sept 3, 2016 0:50:28 GMT -5
Hi all, I was wondering if someone could share some light on a few things for me. First, I would like some general info about stator's. It appears to be the case that some scooters use DC, some AC and others even use a combination of both, AC and DC. First thing I am wondering about is the difference in poles/coils. Does more poles mean that it can generate more electricity? What lead me to this line of question is a few things. I was wanting to add a cigarette lighter/12V power port to my new Scooter (Bintelli Havoc 150cc). I also was wanting to add (or replace with HID) an additional head lamp for my wife's BMS Heritage 150cc. Now, I have been able to locate the wiring diagram for BMS Heritage, however my new havoc, the files are no where to be found. I think the Bintelli Havoc has a 12 pole DC stator. However, I can't find no way to verify this without digging into the engine because there is no parts diagram for the Havoc (There is a parts diagram on Bintellis website, but the diagram has no engine information at all). All I want to know about this Havoc is how much power can the 12 pole stator produce? Also, does anyone have a parts Diagram for the Bintelli Havoc 150cc engine? It is engine model BN157QMJ. I believe it's manufactured by ZNEN. My wifes BMS Heritage; her light "flickers" and is not very bright. With the highs on I have about a 25 ft viewing area and it flickers way too much. Not to the point of a strobe, but very annoying none the less. I have no idea what Stator this scooter has but if anyone else knows, I would love for you to share. Also, I would love it if anyone knew how many watts the Heritage stator can produce? Thank you for any advice you can share! Read more: 49ccscoot.proboards.com/thread/9870/seeking-manuals-wiring-diagrams-stators#ixzz3BB4cUJco |
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