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Post by spandi on Jun 24, 2013 22:44:59 GMT -5
I ride a Zhongneg (aka Znen) 250 A good CHINESE company name.
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Post by scooter12 on Jun 24, 2013 22:47:39 GMT -5
I don't see this occurring.. China may work on some Harley parts today, work on some Honda parts today.. They are out to make a quick buck, but are in business to make money. After 2008, when the auto industry asked for a bailout, well GM sold shares to China. China now has a GM plant in China.. It is companies do this all the time. Company make a lot of money by expanding business worldwide verses staying in one country. But China is the largest population on the planet, so it makes sense that they need more industry to stay a float. Does this hurt us? Yes, because we can't produce as cheap. China also steals ideas from everyone. China does manufacture more motorcycles than any other country.
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Post by scootnwinn on Jun 24, 2013 22:51:31 GMT -5
I thought India was the largest producer of motorcycles... Google it
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Post by spandi on Jun 24, 2013 23:12:09 GMT -5
I thought India was the largest producer of motorcycles... Google it If I remember correctly, isn't that where Genuine scoots are made?
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Post by scooter12 on Jun 24, 2013 23:15:00 GMT -5
Recall the cheap Toyota in the 1970's compared to American cars. This caused many Americans to become angry at Japan because they could not compete. But with inflation and all, over the years, Japan has caught up to us and may have passed us today. I know it is more expensive to live in Japan than the US.. But our auto industry learned to compete with Toyota. The same will occure with China, eventually. They will become higher dollar motorcycles and this will make prices fair. China has a GM plant. We have a Toyota plant. India might be the largest producer, I maybe mistaken..
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Post by scootnwinn on Jun 24, 2013 23:16:21 GMT -5
The Stellas are made there by LML. But those guys are small potatoes compared to Hero and a couple others...
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Post by spandi on Jun 24, 2013 23:21:54 GMT -5
One day the "Old Timers" will look back on today, when they had to fix up their cheap Chinese scooters. The fun, the comradeship, like sports car enthusiasts of yesteryear.
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Post by scootnwinn on Jun 24, 2013 23:25:05 GMT -5
Yep and I'll still be chasing my Vespa with wrenches...
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Post by spandi on Jun 24, 2013 23:30:28 GMT -5
.....and super high quality Chinese scoots will be selling for 15 grand. (Ahh, remember the old days?)
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Post by scooter12 on Jun 24, 2013 23:35:13 GMT -5
Now I heard some Chinese companies have picketers for higher wages.. Hint Hint.. It is going to come to this.. Higher wages means inflation..
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Post by spandi on Jun 24, 2013 23:45:02 GMT -5
It'll happen. When I was a kid "made in Japan" meant Junk. By the time I was in my late teens-early twenties .... (Well you know what happened.)
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Post by prodigit on Jun 24, 2013 23:57:34 GMT -5
China labor also gets more expensive. As human rights groups gain ground, china laws and regulations are bound to become stricter. When safety and health regulations go up, so does the manufacturing cost of plants. Then also lawsuits for when plants broke those regulations. Good workers will get bonuses, bad workers just their pay, or laid off. Just like US in the 1960's, when chinese kids see how their fathers worked their azzez off, to pay for rent, now kids grow up being able to afford cellphones, tv, internet, etc... and without working hard for it. So when those kids go to factories, who haven't worked for anything they really didn't need; the efficiency of human labor goes down. They might even quit, where as their fathers would have sworn their lives to china, even if it costed their lives!
So labor efficiency goes down, cost of materials also goes up, which basically means you can expect a china scoot in a decade or two, to cost ~$2k. Enjoy the prices while they last. I wouldn't worry too much about them. As their products become more expensive, so it becomes less interesting for companies to import from china, as product + shipping + import taxes > manufacture locally. Not yet, but soon it will be.
mark my words, as soon as china is level to a first world country like USA, Japan, or Western Europe, other countries will follow. China, India, Korea, Philipines (Yamaha has plants there), Vietnam, Taiwan (not much success there, they don't really make more than matchbox cars), ... That whole region is being industrialized. The last continent will be Africa, but I don't think they will ever get to be industrialized, because the general people there are too lazy; partly due to the hot and dry weather, partly due to no (or low) education.
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Post by scootnwinn on Jun 24, 2013 23:57:38 GMT -5
I drive a '77 Datsun pick up when it snows and for errands on the weekends. The perception was in the 70's was that Japanese stuff was junk but it was incorrect. The truck has God only knows how many miles and it goes fine I can maintain 80 mph anytime and the truck starts immediately always. The thing is its a great truck was when it was made still is 36 years later. The same is not true if the Chinese scoot they do have workmanship issues and other issues too. The Japanese tried to make the best vehicles they could at low price points. The Chinese build as cheaply as they can and still have something that runs, usually. The Japanese were trying to make a name for themselves the Chinese just want your money. Its not the same. You won't see vintage Chinese scooters like you see vintage Japanese bikes today. Its different much different.
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Post by scooter12 on Jun 25, 2013 0:20:30 GMT -5
My father owned a Toyota station wagon in 1972. It took nearly 3 months for a part to come in. So my Dad sold it. This is much like the Chinese with scooters. They were not planning on shipping junky scooters to consumers and need parts immediately. This gave Toyota a black eye as well as China. Toyota fixed the problem and China has not. One important step China has made an error in, is treating people as human beings. People have tried selling Tank Scooters and when faced with a warranty- well China is to eat the cost. But China does not want to warranty products and puts the warranty on dealers. So a lot of dealers quit dealing in China goods. China never heard it said, to make money one has to spend a little money.. Customer service is terrible. They can sell over the internet, but until they do something to improve their image, most Americans will not buy Chinese scoots. Most Americans don't know how to fix a Chinese scooter.. The ones that do, are getting good buys..lol
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Post by prodigit on Jun 25, 2013 1:12:48 GMT -5
If you're a dealer, you basically need to import a 20 or 30 scoot container, and expect there to be at least 2-4 returns (non working scoots), that can be used for parts.
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