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Post by wheelbender6 on May 15, 2018 21:27:10 GMT -5
Sorry. I just brought up the Vitpilen because I wanted to rant about it. The price of motorcycles is rising much faster than my wages.
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Post by oldchopperguy on May 15, 2018 23:36:47 GMT -5
Kat,
That BV 350 is sweet. After really checking them out, I can see the appeal of them. Very much like yours but a little bigger motor. And, Yes! I'll bet yours will top 70... Sweet ride! These style Italian scoots appeal as I see it is first, performance. Then, general handling, then "Apparent" light weight. I don't think they actually ARE much lighter than other styles, but they FEEL lighter. Probably the phenomenon of tall wheels. Like balancing a baseball bat in the palm of your hand. Place the BIG end in your palm, and it's hard to balance. Place the little end in your palm and it's easy! Same deal with small, and big wheel scoots... I think... Maybe?Whatever the cause, after dropping "Minnie Mouse" last week, in future years as I get "feebler" I may go to the Italian big-wheels... They handle like a bicycle that can run the freeways! THAT feature MUST be nearly irresistible to most riders! Ride safe! Leo PS: Soft saddlebags are "miracle preventatives" for damage from dropping a bike! LOL! 
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Post by oldchopperguy on May 15, 2018 23:49:08 GMT -5
Sorry. I just brought up the Vitpilen because I wanted to rant about it. The price of motorcycles is rising much faster than my wages. Most of us compare motorcycles and scooters in some way or another, and performance and price are the two biggies! Motorcycles are not cheap... But it does appear that Indian has forced Harley Davidson to be a little more "competitive" with their luxury big Chiefs, and budget-priced Scouts... Still too much money for my blood though... Talk about stagnant wages: how'd you like to be stuck on Social Security? 
Sub-$3K used scooters rule in my world! LOL! Old "Minnie Mouse" gets me down the road just as well as a $40K Hog... And gives 85mpg, and $120 full-coverage insurance! Ride safe, Leo |
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Post by wheelbender6 on May 16, 2018 7:11:56 GMT -5
Harley is responding to the success of Indian. They expanded the Sportster line again with some new versions. That will appeal to younger riders and bring more people into the Harley universe.
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Post by SylvreKat on May 16, 2018 23:22:29 GMT -5
Just curious if Victory is still around and making that Star Wars monster-bike that I think included a micro, fridge, and bed? Thing was as long as my Taurie-wagon! (at least it seemed like it) Btb, 350ish pounds does NOT feel lighter. Not to me it doesn't! But my Harley friend sure enjoyed how much more nimble Peej handled than his big cruiser. Never has told me why it took him about 10, 15 minutes longer to get back to my home than I did in my car....  >'Kat |
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Post by w650 on May 17, 2018 13:14:55 GMT -5
Victory was shut down by Polaris so they can concentrate on Indian. The bike you're talking about was the Victory Vision. You either loved it or hated the styling. Personally I think the engine Victory used was better than the Indian boat anchors they have gone to.
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Post by SylvreKat on May 17, 2018 22:40:53 GMT -5
The Vision. Yeah, that was it.
I didn't mind the styling, but I thought it was ridonkculously too long.
>'Kat
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Post by oldchopperguy on May 18, 2018 2:34:14 GMT -5
That Victory Vision WAS "over the top". I'm not a big fan of baggers but admired how all that goofy and gimmicky styling SOMEHOW actually came together OK...  That bike really smacked of "Arlen Ness". I'll bet he had something to do with its design. Long ago when I was still frisky enough to climb on and off big bikes, I rode a few different Victory bikes. I was very impressed with their combination of BOTH torque AND rpm. Great all-around machines! Now that Victory is a brand of the past, their bikes should be great buys. Polaris has committed to provide parts and service for quite some time. I don't know about the new Indian motors compared to the older Victory mills. I know the Victory was great, but Polaris also claims the new Indian Chief "Thunder Stroke" motor is the most road-tested new powerplant to be released in a production vehicle. Maybe, maybe not... They must be pretty good though since I've seen no negative reports on them. The last incarnation of the Indian marque (not by Polaris) used a V-twin motor that was a cosmetic knockout. Just beautiful, but it proved to be very poor. Nothing but trouble. "Indians" before that used Harley-Davidson clone motors and just did not come off as "real" Indians. I am glad that Polaris did choose to design a new Indian from the ground up, and make it reliable from the get-go. I'm a little sad to see them offer one without the trademark skirted fenders though... Ya gotta make what people want.  The highly successful new Indian Scout DOES bear a striking resemblance to some of the old Victory bikes!Ride safe! Leo in Texas |
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Post by w650 on May 18, 2018 15:41:18 GMT -5
Here's the skinny on the Octane/Scout. In 2013 Polaris introduced the Indian Chief at the Sturgis Rally. Big hit. That year Victory was working on the Project 156 for the Pikes Peak Hill Climb. That motor was supposed to go into the Victory Octane.
Polaris decided to plunk the motor into a new Scout in time for the 2014 Sturgis Rally to keep the Indian ball rolling. Again, big hit. But they also put a slightly larger motor into the Octane and offered it months later which made people call the Octane a Scout knockoff.
Wrong. The Octane was supposed to be the home of the engine but Indian got the nod first. If anything the Scout is an Octane knockoff. Of course Polaris torpedoed Victory shortly after that condemning the vastly superior Freedom 106 to the scrap bin. The Thunder Stroke is a pushrod, two valve motor to the Freedom's four valve, overhead cam engine.
Marketing wins again over engineering.
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Post by Jarlaxle on May 25, 2018 21:15:57 GMT -5
I would prefer a 2-valve OHV engine rather than a DOHC multivalve engine if the tradeoff is not needing to adjust valves.
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Post by cyborg55 on May 26, 2018 14:15:59 GMT -5
This is a great thread chopper!!! Keep up the good work!!!
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Post by w650 on May 26, 2018 19:54:02 GMT -5
I would prefer a 2-valve OHV engine rather than a DOHC multivalve engine if the tradeoff is not needing to adjust valves. Most of today's big V-Twins have hydraulic pivot points and never require adjustment. The Freedom 106 engine was refined for 15+ years and has proven to be faster, more modern and compact than the Thunder Stroke motor. Polaris is simply mixing a new Kool Aide that is luring in those disenchanted with Harley. The Thunder Stroke is an engine from the last century and was designed to look that way. It may sell well but the Scout/Octane is a better bike. Plus the Chief Roadmaster weighs 20 pounds more than a six cylinder Gold Wing. Simplicity should weigh a lot less. |
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Post by cyborg55 on May 30, 2018 8:24:17 GMT -5
Like balancing a baseball bat in the palm of your hand. Place the BIG end in your palm, and it's hard to balance. Place the little end in your palm and it's easy! Same deal with small, and big wheel scoots... Whatever the cause, after dropping "Minnie Mouse" last week, in future years as I get "feebler" I may go to the Italian big-wheels... They handle like a bicycle that can run the freeways! THAT feature MUST be nearly irresistible to most riders! Ride safe! Leo PS: Soft saddlebags are "miracle preventatives" for damage from dropping a bike! LOL! Everyone screams about low center of gravity,,,more weight over the rolling axis is key to a good handling bike,,,Honda developed a race bike with everything low,,including the fuel cell,,,it was a major disaster,,the bike handled like caca,,and was scrapped in short order,,,I don't see anything fantastic coming out of Italy except their debt is bigger than ours ratio wise,,,but they do have great design,, |
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Post by shalomdawg on May 30, 2018 18:28:02 GMT -5
howdy y'all
i've been away long enough so thought i'd drap in fer a spell
'missed the oldguy and silverkat and all y'alll. i can second all that ocg says and mention that i sailed from the bv350 to a ctx700 that shifts itself and seems designed specifically for those of us with reduced performance levels. i liked both and have put about 16,000 miles on both so a good test ride for comparisons. like oldchopperguy, i'm challenged to get off and on, but find both ok in their own way. i leave the ctx on the side stand which lets me kinda get the knee on the seat and slide over without tippin' the two of us horizontal. after a spasm and uncontrollable gasp, we get on the way. i've put floorboards and a tail trunk on and built some brackets so i can throw a pair of soft bags over and head out on some sizeable adventures. anyway , this post is to encourage dreamin' which i'm still doing after my heart attack in israel a month ago. i got home tuesday night and was riding on wednesday morning. keep on keepin' on
ken
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Post by oldchopperguy on Jun 1, 2018 10:48:32 GMT -5
Like balancing a baseball bat in the palm of your hand. Place the BIG end in your palm, and it's hard to balance. Place the little end in your palm and it's easy! Same deal with small, and big wheel scoots... Whatever the cause, after dropping "Minnie Mouse" last week, in future years as I get "feebler" I may go to the Italian big-wheels... They handle like a bicycle that can run the freeways! THAT feature MUST be nearly irresistible to most riders! Ride safe! Leo PS: Soft saddlebags are "miracle preventatives" for damage from dropping a bike! LOL! Everyone screams about low center of gravity,,,more weight over the rolling axis is key to a good handling bike,,,Honda developed a race bike with everything low,,including the fuel cell,,,it was a major disaster,,the bike handled like caca,,and was scrapped in short order,,,I don't see anything fantastic coming out of Italy except their debt is bigger than ours ratio wise,,,but they do have great design,,
I can really agree with that! I always found the early Harleys with iron heads and a full gas tank to be easier to handle than bikes with a low center of gravity. My own Kymco Grandvista has most of its weight down low, and while it's "classic scooter" and I'm very used to it, it is almost "squirrely" compared to a heavy bike with lots of steel, fuel, battery and fruit-salad up top.
I taught a LOT of people including teensy ladies to ride on my 1970 Electra-Glide and they all remarked how easy it was to balance... "Much easier than the mopeds and scooters they had tried".Just DON'T let that 900-pounds get tipped TOO far over when you're an eighty-five-pounder, used to lifting nothing heavier than lettuce leaves to your diminutive puss... LOL!
Weight "up high" vs. weight "down low" indeed makes a big difference in ease of balance... Especially at very slow "walking" speeds. That IS one small factor making many prefer a large motorcycle, but for us who are used to them, scooters are just fine, once you get used to them. Ride safe!Leo in Texas |
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