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Post by 4950cycle on Feb 4, 2017 15:27:23 GMT -5
JCL MP250A Lihai 257cc powered Just did an oil change on my JCL and made double sure not to over fill it to get that out of the way right off. Went for a quick 5 mile rounder on her and right before I got back to the house I hear a loud hissing sound over the motor sound for about 5 or six seconds then the scooter quit pulling. Oil all over the CVT .Someone please tell me there is a replaceable shaft seal from the outside of the engine under the variator. I have not done a full investigation but I think this is where it is comeing from. Has this ever happened to anyone else ?
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Post by bob123456789 on Feb 4, 2017 17:59:06 GMT -5
4950cycle. I have not had the same experience you had. If it helps, here is a similar service manual I am using. It is not for our scooters. It is for a ATV with a 260 cc engine. The relevant section starts on page 3 A-19 (260cc). Please use it at your own risk as it is not an exact match for our scooters. www.manualslib.com/manual/908522/Linhai-2004-Atv-260.html?page=41#manual
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Post by 4950cycle on Feb 4, 2017 22:26:28 GMT -5
JCL MP250A Lihai 257cc powered / Thank you very much. I will certainly have a look see. Did you get that nipple out ?
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Post by 4950cycle on Feb 4, 2017 23:20:14 GMT -5
JCL MP250A Lihai 257cc powered / Looked and looked but couldn't find any info on the crank shaft seals. Thanks anyway.
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Post by rockynv on Feb 5, 2017 8:32:42 GMT -5
If there is a lot of blow by the crank seal behind the Variator can get blown out. Excessive engine vibration can cause it to walk out. Since you lost drive you need to pull the CVT cover to clean up the mess and replace the belt regardless of the source of the oil as a drive belt once it gets oil on it will not last very long and as it starts to come apart belt cords will wrap around the drive shaft destroying the oil seal behind the variator. Hopefully the oil has not gotten inside the clutch and soaked into the friction pads.
By the parts listings on Parts for Scooters they are press in seals which can be installed with cautious use of a hammer and a length of pipe that is the same outside diameter as the seal and long enough that you will not accidentally damage the end of the crankshaft.
Be sure to verify the correct size seal used on your bike as there appear to be a few different sizes along with a smaller one for the right side of the bike behind the magneto cover.
Yes others have occasionally had crank shaft seals wear out or get damaged by old or defective belts that are in the process of failing.
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Post by dollartwentyfive on Feb 5, 2017 8:50:47 GMT -5
If there is a lot of blow by the crank seal behind the Variator can get blown out. this would indicate a blow-by vent hose is plugged somehow. oil or grease on friction surfaces causes them to glaze. i've heard that once this happens, the pads (brake or clutch) must be replaced, they CANNOT be sanded down and reused.
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Post by rockynv on Feb 5, 2017 9:41:03 GMT -5
If there is a lot of blow by the crank seal behind the Variator can get blown out. this would indicate a blow-by vent hose is plugged somehow. oil or grease on friction surfaces causes them to glaze. i've heard that once this happens, the pads (brake or clutch) must be replaced, they CANNOT be sanded down and reused. Yep hoses and purge systems do get plugged by old oil or collapse from the heat once the blow by gets bad enough. The also get capped by some when trying to bypass evap systems. When the pads get soaked they have to be replaced however if they are just smokey from a oily fog you can many times get by with using some brake lining cleaner. Its a judgement call. No matter what though the CVT case and any contaminated components needs to be completely cleaned out of all oil along with the belt and possibly the rollers replaced regardless of the source of the oil.
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Post by 4950cycle on Feb 6, 2017 11:22:52 GMT -5
JCL MP250A Lihai 257cc powered / I was running an open CVT (no cover). I was doing research on tuning the CVT for optimum performance. BTW, No belt shredding going on. Belt up to width spec. Was keeping to close of an eye on it for any negligence junk to go on. My main question right now was can I pull the variator side crank seal from the outside of the engine with a drilled hole with a screw in the seal with a pair of pliers or simular ?
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Post by bob123456789 on Feb 6, 2017 11:41:32 GMT -5
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Post by bob123456789 on Feb 6, 2017 11:43:48 GMT -5
If you want to you can download the entire pdf file then just print out the pages you need 96-100.
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Post by rockynv on Feb 6, 2017 22:01:17 GMT -5
If its already open then you should be able to clearly see where the oil is coming from. Have you removed the variator yet? The seal is behind it and cannot be removed by going up from underneath like some of the older car engines as it is a one piece pressed in seal like on a wheel bearing, You may find once the variator has been removed that the seal already popped out and removal is not an issue. Yes you can cautiously hook the seal and pull it however you have to be very careful about nicking the shaft where the seal rides or damaging the bearing and its cage behind the seal. There is only about 1/8 to 3/16 of an inch of space between the face of the seal and the bearing behind it so you can't use a screw with a very long point if you go that route. You may want to get the replacement seal first so you can measure exactly how much room you have to work with before drilling.
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Post by 4950cycle on Feb 7, 2017 1:13:33 GMT -5
JCL MP250A Lihai 257cc powered / Thank you Rocky and Bob1234. According to the diagram Bob123... turned me on to its a blind hole the seal sits in (besides the shaft coming thru center). Shouldn't be much danger of damaging much with this design . Can be done after variator off. No, I haven't taken the variator off yet Rocky. I've been working on getting my Bobber running To get it ready to sell. Thanks agian, I love knowing what I'm getting into on repairs like this. And I will look for any Crank case venting problems to boot .
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Post by rockynv on Feb 7, 2017 5:43:17 GMT -5
JCL MP250A Lihai 257cc powered / Thank you Rocky and Bob1234. According to the diagram Bob123... turned me on to its a blind hole the seal sits in (besides the shaft coming thru center). Shouldn't be much danger of damaging much with this design . Can be done after variator off. No, I haven't taken the variator off yet Rocky. I've been working on getting my Bobber running To get it ready to sell. Thanks agian, I love knowing what I'm getting into on repairs like this. And I will look for any Crank case venting problems to boot . There is a lot of danger in causing damage to the metal surface of the shaft where the seal rides and while the bearing is on the crank and is located inside the crankcase the parts diagram in the manual does not clearly show how much clearance the shaft has where it goes through the case to the seal area or how much separation there is. Caution is still advisable until you have at least the rubber center of the seal cut out and can see how close and exposed the bearing is behind it.
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Post by bob123456789 on Feb 7, 2017 10:11:34 GMT -5
Glad to hear you are now pointed in the right direction and feel comfortable with the issue.
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Post by 4950cycle on Feb 7, 2017 22:09:50 GMT -5
JCL MP250A Lihai 257cc powered / I hear you Rock. And Thank you for finding the info I could not Bob 123... .
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