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Post by JR on Sept 2, 2013 18:50:20 GMT -5
I just discovered by looking at the videos all posted on You tube and found that they were all done in 2009. Over four years ago and I searched long and hard and haven't found another Public Safety Warning as they called it since?
Seems like a dealer here on this thread mentioned something about the Chinese coming a long way in the last few years? I also remember the market being flooded in 08 and 09 with Chinese scooters due to the $4 a gallon gas hike. Seems POC has went silent since then?
JR
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Post by JR on Sept 2, 2013 18:20:41 GMT -5
No what is absurd is you believing his claims based upon a video that "says" these things are wrong? So what are the facts that make you think he's telling the truth? He said this was what was wrong isn't proof. He said one inch of slack in the steering bearing? He said no oil. So if you're going to tell me something is dangerous show me why. Anyone can sit on a street and claim anything. Also I'm not putting anything on trial, just simply saying that I don't believe all his claims. Didn't say he was lying, said he didn't support his claims. Now you can try to twist your reasoning any way you want and again if you want to believe him that's your choice but don't try to put words in my mouth because I think other wise. I told you what I think. Made by the same company? Made by the Chinese all my scooters are Chinese. All cheaper online crate models. From day one they have never been dangerous. BTW what do you ride? After 600 miles one should not expect to discover there's no transmission oil, among the other issues.Again why was he riding it with no oil? Did he check it at 500 miles like recommended? Oh that's right the video didn't mention that it just said no oil and dangerous. How we would know what happened? Did the guy take the time to explain when, how and what happened here? So his just pushing the front handle bar down is proof enough of bad steering bearings? Also not mentioned was this a online do it yourself PDI scooter that the owner just hopped on a started riding? Was it a B&M scooter? Surely if we are to believe that this is a dangerous scooter some back ground "facts" would be nice to support these claims? Yet you believe him on just what he said alone in this video? Now who's being absurd? His audience wasn't mechanics trying to learn how to fix the transmission.....it was NEW consumers to scooters.People with little knowledge of what going on. You left one thing out here, NEW consumers. Correctly said meant NEW customers. So even you recognize the true meaning of this video. What better way to get you to the Kymco dealership!  JR |
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Post by JR on Sept 2, 2013 16:15:46 GMT -5
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Post by JR on Sept 2, 2013 11:50:55 GMT -5
I don't think Rocky's figures are off, the man knows what they sell up the street. I just said you can shop and there are options to pay without getting stuck with unnecessary money paid to interest and finance charges. Heck I even bought the go kart on Pay Pals buy now and bill me later, paid for it in the time frame allowed with not a extra nickel in charges.
I could do the same on a Kymco or any other scooter because at present I have a $8k credit limit. Even some of the scooter dealers do special offers same as cash.
Soon mowing season will be over and I'm watching a deal at home depot when they mark the big mowers off 20 to 25% plus will offer a 10% discount by signing up for their credit card and 180 days to pay same as cash. The mower I'm looking at is a huge 56 deck and one of the steering wheel less type and is presently listed at $4999.
So 30% off = $1500 and 6 payments of $584 appx and this doesn't include tax but it's still under $600 a month. I have 5 acres to mow and next year plan on hitting it with two mowers. (8)
JR
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Post by JR on Sept 2, 2013 11:14:58 GMT -5
Misinformation? Since when is $1650.00 Plus 2 or 3 hundred (the price difference according to you) equal to 3 or 4 THOUSAND? If you wish to engage in feel-good thinking about not having bought your scoot from "local ripoff artists" as a way of convincing yourself the oft repeated "deal" you got was better than it was, so be it. But do not try and delude others that the difference between say, a Roketa 250 www.superiorpowersports.com/250cc_Gas_Scooter_p/rk250sc-54b.htm (probably the most common 250 purchase) and an Aprilia is "ONLY" a couple of C notes. Reality will prove otherwise every time. I guess you have a problem comprehending that I have not spoken of other than local prices which I just verified this morning. I have taken great care to be explicit about my prices being "Real World Prices" from "Local Brick and Mortor Shops" selling Chinese Clones Bikes in the "Tampa Bay Florida" market. 50cc Chinese Clones sell locally for $1,199 to $1,399 while 150cc Chinese Clones sell locally for $1,499 to $1,799 and 250cc Chinese Clones sell locally for $2,599 to $2,799 and again that is from "Local" brick and mortor stores in Tampa Bay verified as of about 20 minutes ago. You are not comparing apples to apples if you compare a drop shipped bike to a name brand bike from a local dealer as that would be an unfair comparison. I am comparing pricing from a half dozen or so Local Chinese Clone Dealers to Local Name Brand Dealers and I have left out the pricing from the local Ripp-Off Chinese Clone Dealers to make it fair, of which fact I have also clearly disclosed. Lets be really clear and explicit now that I have been talking above about "Local" prices from "Local Dealers". To me there is no value in buying a bike on-line with a credit card at 20% to 30% even at the $1,889.  that the Roketa 54B real price comes out to be with just a 30 days parts only warranty. If you match the warranty on the time frame bumping it to 1 year parts only the Roketa bike then becomes $1,988. and you still need to pay sales tax on registration along with fully service the bike changing the antifreeze, engine oil, gear lube and brake fluid adding another $50 to $100 for the fluids only if you do it yourself more if you pay someone. If you want fuel injection or a even only a reliable belt then that will cost you extra also. Most too will be making the minimum payment on the credit card which can drag the total cost up to potential $6,000 to $8,000 dollars when for little to no money down with 3 or 4 year dealer financing the total cost of the $2,999 Aprilia will be around $4,000 or potentially half the cost of buying the self service bargain on-line with a credit card. In the final analysis you end up with much less bike for a lot more money with the bike being past its usefull service life well before it has been paid for when you buy a bargain on-line with a credit card. Indeed a Chinese Clone bike can be great fun but just like a fake Rolex it is what it is and not the really great value many make them out to be. They are a roll of the dice and something I couldn't afford to gamble on a second time. Pesonally I did not have to cash to pay out on the basically, now lets be honest, $2,000 internet special 54B and would have had to finance it one way or another. When amortizing out all the various finance options on a 54B or Vog 260 (credit card, second mortgage) it became very clear that the Aprilia with local dealer financing along with a full service 12 month warranty (for a few hundred more I bumped it to a full 4 years), free factory technical services and actual free recall services if required was the cost and value leader by a landslide. Rocky I don't for one minute doubt your prices in "your" area so let's compare prices at a Chinese B&M store in my area. Here is a little company that has two locations and both are less than one hour from me where I live in the sticks. ;D www.hometownatvandmore.com/locationsThe one in Conway I have been to many times, in fact know the mechanic pretty well and yes they have a full time mechanic and offer warranty on the things they sell which is scooters, go karts, atvs, etc. They sell only Chinese. Now on their site they do not list prices and there is a reason. Cash will get you a cheaper price and they do offer financing also. They offer sometimes during holidays to 180 days to pay same as cash too. Now I can appreciate folks that need to fund something like you said but it's hard to believe that most people can't afford 3 to 6 payments same as cash on even a $3k scooter, if you can't then yes as you said you'll add extra costs in interest charges. Also as I said shopping is important even on a credit card. If I bought one today and I have before I have a card that if I pay it off in 30 days no finance charge and no interest and since I have excellent credit the card that I have now for over 30 years is at 7.5% interest instead of the crazy 19% or above that some have. Also if you have good credit Pay Pal is offering 180 days same as cash right now especially if you already have an account and a good history like I do. I can pay for your $4k scooter in 180 days and most people if they are disciplined can too and not pay a penny of interest so again there are other options that you haven't listed or considered when buying and both can be done on Chinese and name brand. So even the what you call small $200 to $300 difference can be done without extra costs and $300 is a considerable amount to me. Why? I'm retired and have all the time I want to make sure my cheaper investment is up to par and I'll use the $300 saved to go fishing or buy my wife a nice gift. I also don't have to say again that my scooters have performed and are still performing to my standards so the money I saved means a lot to me. Now lets go back to the local price thing. I couldn't verify today's prices on their scooters, I tried and called but they are closed for labor day but I can relate to prices from last December when I purchased a new go kart for my grand kids.  This was last Christmas day and they couldn't even ride it because at the end of the day we had 26" of snow on the ground. Now here is the go kart I bought from Killer: www.killermotorsports.com/TrailMaster_200cc_XRX_Off_Road_Go_Cart_Dune_Buggy_p/tm-mid-xrx.htmI bought it from Killer for $1499 delivered, had to put wheels, steering wheel, cage and battery on. The grandkids are riding it right now as I type. The company I listed above while they do not have this go kart on their website presently had the same exact go kart, even the same color for $1699 and it was assembled and ready to ride. That's without sales tax another reason I bought online with no sale tax it saved me and additional $152.91 Here is the 250A which is a carbon copy and sister to the 250B and last December it was $1899 and ready to ride, prepped and with 6 months parts warranty. Here is one of the 3 models of 50cc scooters they had and I remember they were all under $1k and are Jonways, not a bad brand. Again I do not know a price as of today. I haven't been to their shop since last December. They also stock a very good supply of parts and are reasonable. Like I said shopping makes a difference and with the prices you listed in your area I would get a pitcher of ice tea and wait for a truck to deliver a scooter to me in a crate and I would shop on that too, I wouldn't pay those prices no way no how. BTW here is the current 250 listed at Killer and I can assure you if it gets to your house and has a scratch on it they'll take care of you. Do take note of their payment options listed which includes some of the options I mentioned. One can take $62.54 off just by paying with a money order or cashiers check. Also you are wrong about sales tax, online purchases at least in my state = zero. If you buy from Killer in Texas you will pay Texas state tax. Title and registration for me is $25 tags are $5.50 a year and I insure four scooters for less than $200 a year. They price below is delivered. www.killermotorsports.com/250cc_Cruiser_Gas_Scooter_w_Trunk_Alarm_p/r-mc-54-250.htmI also wouldn't throw my savings away on paying interest or finance charges on any purchase of $4k or less even on a name brand scooter. JR |
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Post by JR on Sept 2, 2013 7:58:01 GMT -5
You're not sure of nothing. You weren't present when the bearing in question was found nor replaced. You're at a point now of just running your mouth and trying to annoy and make people mad. Like I said give it a break. JR I'm sure that a Cavalier doesn't have a Toyota engine. Ride a few thousand miles on the Chinese 250 and if the rest of it holds up, then you can tell us if the new bearing failed, and then we'll all be sure. Bravo on you mature response. In regards to your poor moderator attitude and your fascination with this thread and topic, I think it's appropriate to thank you for modifying one of my posts. It shows good taste and class  I'll give it a rest when you do  I'm not going away, I guess you'll have to ban me. I'm not sure for what, I'm just defending my position like everyone else. I guess I'm just pissing you off for debating in a thread that was specifically about the issue that I (and others) are talking about. Keep up the good work mod! Good guess. |
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Post by JR on Sept 2, 2013 7:55:00 GMT -5
So you're assuming the guy is lying. You don't believe his claims. I have no reason to assume he is. I think he's telling us the truth. No I'm saying he could have easily shown us his claims on the video, how hard is it to video a bearing with one inch of slack? Remember two sides of the coin. Again we know nothing of the rider, his mechanical skills, how he has treated the scooter, even if he has done any PM? Most people change the oils at least at the 500 mile mark, which even in the bad Chinese manuals is recommended, so would not any responsible owner have seen that the rear axle had trouble or possibly no oil? If he did then he just kept riding it? See that's just an assumption on my part just as his video is not supported by anything other than this is dangerous and has the POC telling you to not ride these scooters. If the scooter was so bad and so dangerous then he could have done this video in his shop, supported all his claims with actual evidence on the video and also told us what the conditions were, His only comment on the rider was he wasn't too heavy. One can say anything on a video but if I were making these claims and they were in fact true I would show you the evidence and leave no doubt. You want to believe him, your choice and right, me I see a video aimed at getting you to his dealership, nothing more. Show me the bad bearings, no oil in the tranny, bad seal that was caused by a bent shaft and then I'll say this was a real problem. BTW I also have a 150 the Bali, it's a lot heavier than that 150 and it has 4700 miles on it, no bent shaft, no bad steering bearings, no charging problems and still has the OEM tires on it even though they do need replacing now and it has the same exact engine as this poor scooter in the video. I weigh 250lbs and have rode it in 100F + temps and it has never had these troubles. Why? Because I take care of it. I also can put that on a video with no trouble too. Is he laying? Don't know and he also could have videoed the speedo with just 600 miles, he did not. IMO just a sales pitch and he didn't support his claims to make it any different IMO. JR |
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Post by JR on Sept 1, 2013 22:15:50 GMT -5
A rear swingarm bearing starting to fail somewhere less than 4000 miles? I've never experienced that on any of my Japanese or Taiwanese motorcycles or scooters at any amount of mileage. If all you could find was a Chinese bearing to replace it, I'm sure it will last longer than the original, which was probably the lowest price component money could buy ;D You're not sure of anything. You weren't present when the bearing in question was found nor replaced. You're at a point now of just running your mouth and trying to annoy and make people mad. Like I said give it a break. JR |
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Post by JR on Sept 1, 2013 22:12:20 GMT -5
Insanity is actually at an all time high Gitsum... Yeah, they don't seem to want to discuss or consider the Taiwanese "budget" models, it doesn't support the argument of Chinese scooter value. When someone found a new 2010 Kymco Agility 125 for under a grand, they just dissed it as too old or a fake. I paid cash for a new 2009 Suzuki TU250X at the end of 2011, it was still looking brand spanking new and had 5 miles on it, just like that Kymco probably does. I guess a Chinese scooter with cheap plastic panels and a low class paint job must deteriorate badly after just sitting around on the show room floor for a couple of years  I wish I lived closer to the awesome deal on the Agility, I'd buy just for the price, whether I need it or not. You seem to not be happy with what others here seem to like or want to buy/ride? Maybe you need to go somewhere where people with the budget scooters like what you say? You've made your case about the scooters you like and your opinions have been noted and heard and they are now getting off topic to this threads intent, so as I suggested before get off of the  and give it a break. JR |
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Post by JR on Sept 1, 2013 19:08:19 GMT -5
[replyingto=gitsum]gitsum[/replyingto]It's Mr. Jack off and you need to lighten up and bit and get off that pedestal . Smile and remember it's all what you like in anything you buy.   JR |
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Post by JR on Sept 1, 2013 11:14:29 GMT -5
I guess some folks just hate to admit that dollar for dollar Chinese scoots are a much better value than those high priced "Motor Snooters" I got my new 2009 model year fuel injected Aprilia Sport City 250 manufactured in fall of 2010 with 5 miles on it for $2,999 from a local Aprilia dealer in May of 2011 when at the same time for $2,699/$2,799 I could have gotten a 2007 or 2008 Chinese 250 that had been sitting in a crate since 2007/2008 from a local dealer. The Aprilia came with a full year parts and labor warranty from a manufacturer known to stand behind their product with factory trained technicians at their authorized dealerships across the country while the Chins es 250 came with a days parts only warranty and none of the technicians are factory trained or certified. To me the extra $200 to $300 was well spent and made the Aprilia a much, much better value than a locally purchase Chinese scooter. It would cost more than that to convert the Chinese bike to fuel injection and you still would not have a bike that equals the Aprilia. I found that I could not afford the Chinese bike and that the Aprilia especially when factoring in the dealer support and financing was and is very much more affordable. Everyone seems to be hung up on MSRP which is not what most of us would pay. If you went by MSRP then most Chinese bikes are just as if not more expensive than the Vespa. For example a 150cc Znen MC_ZN150T9 according to some sites has a List or MSRP value of $4,999 which is higher than that of the 250cc Aprilia sport City and the Port Injected Vespa LX 150. I bought my wife's 250A in 2009 for $1200 from Killermotorsports and picked it up on a visit see my sons in Dallas but I could have paid $99 to have it shipped over four hours away to Arkansas. Since I was going to Dallas anyway I saved the $99 and got a few goodies thrown in for the guys at Killer to boot. 6 months warranty on all parts to go with it even though I never needed any. Scooter now has 4k on it, my wife doesn't ride as much I do, only issue was stopped up jets due to poor gas once and that's not the scooters fault. BTW it's a 07 which now makes it 6 years old still has all OEM parts, R/R, CDI, carb, variator and original belt which was a quality Gates Powerlink. I have replaced the back swingarm bearing and the fuel pump, not because it had failed but because I just got a deal on 4 mikuins for $20 on a close out and figured what the heck change the old fuel pump when you replace the filter. The bearing had not failed but when doing a tire replacement I found it was heading in that direction so I replaced it, all part of doing some PM on a machine. Like in anything you buy, shopping and having a friend or two saves money. JR |
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Post by JR on Sept 1, 2013 11:04:27 GMT -5
I guess some folks just hate to admit that dollar for dollar Chinese scoots are a much better value than those high priced "Motor Snooters" If you want to gamble with your life perhaps... If you are one that is new to scooters and you're not sure which direction to go and want to avoid being ripped off, then educate yourself. Some Chinese clones can be very DANGEROUS. Don't ignore these video's, learn from them before making any decisions on how to best spend your money. It's true, up front one can save hundreds of dollars buying Chinese clones. However, if you're not mechanically inclined, those saving will be passed on to your local mechanic who will happily take your money. That is if you can find one within 50 miles of your home. Then you have to figure out if you can trust his work and prices. All hype by a B&M dealer making a sales pitch. Every single item he described was pure lack of PM by a either not knowing or lack of effort by the person who owned the scooter. I have 4 scooters 3 with alarms no battery issue and one can have a weak or dead battery even on a auto if the battery is poor quality, the vehicle is not ran much or the battery is very old. Example, I have very good quality marine batteries on my camper and boat. But I keep a solar charger on them for times of periods when I don't use them. If his battery is dead overnight, it's a poor battery and if the scooter isn't charging it's still his lack of an easy fix. Just like this guy who is putting on a show about these scooters if you do nothing to keep a machine maintained and PM'd it'll go down sooner or later. Also all the hype about neglecting name brand things and it running longer? So what about the name brand scooters that even built elsewhere that have Chinese parts? Do the people who make the parts in China make better parts for them? Also this is sad to say but about 4 weeks ago I put a new back tire on my wife's 250 because the one on it was worn out. When I removed the back swing arm I noticed the axle bearing had the seal missing on the inside and was collecting dirt, not a good thing. This is a common 6303 size bearing, used tons of them through out my working career on various things. Went to town with the intent of buying a better non-Chinese bearing, went to Napa, Crow Burlingame, and O'reilly. Napa had three brands of this bearing and the other two had two. Guess what? It still has a Chinese bearing on it. I'm sure there is a American made bearing but after 3 parts stores I got tired of the search. Dangerous? Dangerous is people who buy stuff they know nothing about, don't have the willingness or attitude to learn, or want to blame other people for their lack of desire to do any of the above IMO. JR |
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Post by JR on Aug 31, 2013 10:04:06 GMT -5
[A Cavilier is inferior to a Cadillac. Does that mean the Cavilier is not road worthy or will not last 200,000 miles or will not give good service? IMO and experience, a Chinese machine that is properly maintained and not abused will give many miles and years of great service at a fraction of the cost of their competitors. Also, replacement parts are really inexpensive compared to others. A Cavalier will not stay on the road as long as a Toyota given the same maintenance. But an even bigger difference in quality is observed with poor maintenance. The Toyota can be neglected and still perform with admirable reliability, the Cavalier will not enjoy the same trouble free longevity by a large margin. The same applies to a Chinese scooter vs. a Taiwanese or Japanese scooter. The price savings of a Chinese scooter just isn't a valid argument anymore. People will pay $1300 - $1500 for a " better" quality Znen 150cc. But now you can buy several different SYM or Kymko models assembled in China for $1800 to $1900. Let's not even compare a $995 "internet special", after all the point of this comparison is determining whether or not quality and durability is equal between Chinese brands vs. Taiwanese/Japanese ones. This goes to show you sir how little you know about the Chevy Cavalier and Prism. The Prism is an exact copy of the Toyota Corolla and even has the Corolla engine down to the last nut and bolt. Most of the Cavaliers had Toyota engines. BTW I put over 200k on a Cavalier and my daughter still has a 2000 Prism with 175k and is in the desert with her Marine husband at Twenty Nine palms Calif and the temp yesterday was 114F at 5 p.m. Little car runs like a champ. Also I have a  Silverado with 177k on it and it's had a starter and sparkplug wire replacement. 4 X 4 and it'll still out pull the Tundra any day of the week. I just traded in my sons' Toyata Corolla with 135k on it and it was drinking oil, been serviced perfectly. Got him a 2008 Cobalt with 70k on it and it runs sweet. Toyota? Not what they used to be and the Japanese know it. Also more cars are coming home to be built now: www.facebook.com/notes/chevrolet/all-new-name-for-all-new-us-built-small-car-chevrolet-sonic/10150342140320521JR |
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Post by JR on Aug 31, 2013 9:54:00 GMT -5
I've been reading and monitoring this thread from the start and there are a lot of good points here pro and con and yes it has bordered on the theme of political and has had a few moments where I've been concerned about a flame war but over all everyone has been able to keep things in a perspective that allows this discussion to keep moving forward. I'm going to add my (o) for what it's worth. The title of this thread opens a lot of doors. For those who are Chinese scooter fans/owners it questions why the arrogance but it IMO also addresses other products as well. This in turn opens another door and for the opinions of the name brand people who think Chinese products are inferior and do not own/ride any of them. Since both doors are open then opinions are going to come and be allowed from both. There's where we sometimes get in to trouble. An opinion of they are inferior and even called junk is allowed as long as someone isn't directly in a rude and offensive manner calling other member's scooters junk and insulting someone. That was mentioned by a member in this thread and on the other side of the coin it was mentioned by a member here that you asked this question so you need to also hear why the arrogance. IMO there was no insult nor rudeness, again one is entitled to an opinion. Poking fun at something which all of us do sometimes again as long as it is not directed in a blatantly offensive manner towards another member is not being rude or offensive. We've had opinions on why some think they are inferior because of metal and then a good rebuttal from a member who works and deals with scooters everyday and both were very well said and informative nothing wrong with that. We also have discussed labor standards, and practices here and there and haven't let it get out of hand on the bad subject of political so far and let's keep it that way. So with all that said here's how I see it or my opinion. It's no secret that I own/ride Chinese 250 scooters and I own 4 scooters 50cc to 250cc and all are Chinese for various reasons I own them. I also believe very much in the power and results of the PDI and when I say this I mean it whole heartily. My 250B now has nearly 13k on it and it's only had a minor hick up or two that hasn't disabled or stranded me, cost me any repair money and I mean none. Also the 13k on this scooter was not babying it either. I've stated this before and I'll state it again, I've made 5 trips from my home in Arkansas to see my sons in Dallas Tx which is 408 miles through the back roads one way or a total of 816 miles round trip. That's over 4k in miles. Most of the time I left on a Friday and came back on Sunday and the last rip was in mid July with temps at 106F when I arrived at Dallas. I rode the snot out my scooter at speeds of 55 mph + and only stopped for gas and a sandwich one time on the way. I wouldn't be afraid of riding this scooter anywhere including the CB run. Would I make it? Don't know? So you ask alright JR are you signed up? Nope. Reason? I thought I was retired and about kid free ( as far as kids at home) until two years ago when I had to take over raising two of my grandchildren now ages 9 and 11. For those of you who have kids these age I don't have to tell you that things like baseball, football, school, and just keeping up with kids eliminates any time to do something like the CB run and my wife is a full time nurse and just wouldn't understand what she would call a nutty idea to try to ride any kind of scooter 3500 miles! ((o p) But I would love to be the first to give it a go on a Chinese scooter. But I am going to do one thing this spring, I'm going to take off to New Orleans and that's a pretty good little ride for sure.  As far as inferior metal I can attest to Chinese stainless steel compared to even Brazilian stainless steel. It has poorer strength and in some cases where it is used in a caustic environment, rusting is an issue. My opinion is based upon doing lots of fabrication work in the food industry where items built and used are regulated by USDA and the FDA. Stainless steel is just about the only thing now approved for food contact in the manufacturing process when preparing food items. If it rusts it will be condemned immediately and for some of the companies that I built things for my company which I was a partner in had to provide invoices to the plants as to where or what kind of stainless steel we used as far as grade and where it came from. Some plants would not allow Chinese made stainless steel, period. This was some time ago as I sold my part of the company a few years back. Don't know if that's changed or not? JR |
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Post by JR on Aug 30, 2013 16:23:37 GMT -5
Aw man, if only you'd thought of that sooner, Doug! Too late to get time off for a road trip. Plus I don't think the sushis would enjoy it.  Have a safe trip, and a great time with your folks! >'Kat What? Never say never!!!  Now if we can get old Doug to ease a little east to Ft. Smith then you can drop down old US 71 south from KC. Oh Doug! Ft. Smith is right on Int40!  JR |
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that the Roketa 54B real price comes out to be with just a 30 days parts only warranty. If you match the warranty on the time frame bumping it to 1 year parts only the Roketa bike then becomes $1,988.
Silverado with 177k on it and it's had a starter and sparkplug wire replacement. 4 X 4 and it'll still out pull the Tundra any day of the week. 