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Post by wheelbender6 on Oct 27, 2013 9:41:31 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Oct 27, 2013 18:55:53 GMT -5
They all look real to me  |
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Post by oldchopperguy on Nov 20, 2013 1:55:34 GMT -5
Holy sonic-boom Batman!
THAT appears to be an F-104 Starfighter with the wings removed and wheels attached! While at Fort Bragg, I got a demo in one of them (2-seat special) back in 1969 complete with firing a burst from the 20mm Gatling-Gun, THEN going full-afterburner and CATCHING UP WITH THE BULLETS AND PASSING THEM!
Sorta lends new meaning to "Faster than a speeding-bullet..." And WE think CROTCH-ROCKETS are fast? DANG! Would THAT thing GO! They didn't call it "The MISSILE with a MAN in it" for nothing! Guess THIS missile has a WOMAN in it! Talk about a fast gal...
Leo in Texas
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Post by wilds on Nov 20, 2013 3:29:10 GMT -5
I never thought it was possible to catch up with a bullet from an M61 Vulcan (20mm Gatling gun).
Muzzle velocity of the M61 Vulcan is 3445 ft/sec.
F-104 max speed is 1450 mph Which is 2126 ft/sec.
The bullet from the M61 Vulcan will leave the muzzle with 3445 ft/sec. + the airplane speed.
Even if the F-104 Starfighter after firing is going up to max speed it shouldn't catch up with the bullets.
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Post by wilds on Nov 20, 2013 6:55:49 GMT -5
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Post by oldchopperguy on Nov 23, 2013 3:30:17 GMT -5
Back in 1968, I was stationed at Fort Bragg, NC. I had a friend who flew and trained pilots on the F-104, and he took me on a "fun tour" of the firing range in a fully-armed 2-seat Starfighter trainer. I'm not a pilot... so my technical knowledge is not what it would be if I was a pilot, but...
For the "speeding-bullet" experiment, he throttled back to "low, slow and dirty" of about 250 mph (or whatever the lowest speed those mini-wings would stay aloft). He then fired a burst from the 20mm and went to full-afterburner. The tracers never got out of sight, and, after a few seconds got closer and closer, until we caught and passed them.
The wing leading-edges and bottom of the windshield were glowing red from the air friction. The mach-meter showed us at the edge of mach-3, or somewhere around 2,200 mph. I assume that the bullets had dropped in velocity to less than 2,000 mph by then.
I know the Starfighter was conservatively rated at less than 1,500 mph, but it would do WAY better than that. I spoke with my stepson who is an executive at Lockheed, and he explained that in that era, missiles were not what they are today, and the F-104 was made to get from the ground to the upper atmosphere ASAP to intercept incoming bombers. It never was a dogfighter... no turning ability. It's sole attribute was brute acceleration and top-speed. They don't like to admit it, but a few of them in early testing came apart at undisclosed speeds of near 3,000 mph. And at least one shot itself down by flying into its own bullets during testing of the Vulcan cannon. (That phenomenon actually made it on network news in the late fifties!)
The worst problem with that gun was the gasses it built up FAST inside the nose, which sometimes would detonate, blowing the front of the aircraft to bits, and forcing the unhappy pilot to use its freaky downward-ejection seat. (Can't use THAT one on the tarmac... LOL). Lockheed devised it because the standard ejection seat firing "up" couldn't get the pilot past the tall tail at high speed. Whew, what a rocket!
I truly believe the F-104 was quietly the fastest (non-experimental) plane on earth until the very latest fighters. The Air Force just didn't want it advertised...
Sincerely,
Leo in Texas
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Post by wilds on Nov 23, 2013 3:58:17 GMT -5
You are also from the "Pre-Digital" era!
These fighter planes can scare the s**t out you!
A long time ago I served in the French Foreign Legion as a paratrooper and we had an exercise with the French Air Force and their Mirage 2000.
We were driving down a road and all of us were standing in the back of a truck and scouting around us for the planes that we knew would come. When you finaly saw the planes come from far away it was too late, a second later they passed us with afterburners on. It was a frightening experience to see how vulnerable you are. And the SOUND, it sounded like thunder just over your head!
The pilots reported back that they had us on the radar long before we saw them and that they easily could've taken us out with missiles before we realized what was going on.
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Post by oldchopperguy on Nov 23, 2013 14:54:38 GMT -5
You are also from the "Pre-Digital" era! These fighter planes can scare the s**t out you! A long time ago I served in the French Foreign Legion as a paratrooper and we had an exercise with the French Air Force and their Mirage 2000. We were driving down a road and all of us were standing in the back of a truck and scouting around us for the planes that we knew would come. When you finaly saw the planes come from far away it was too late, a second later they passed us with afterburners on. It was a frightening experience to see how vulnerable you are. And the SOUND, it sounded like thunder just over your head! The pilots reported back that they had us on the radar long before we saw them and that they easily could've taken us out with missiles before we realized what was going on. Pre-digital? These days, I feel pre-historic!  Those fifties/sixties fighters WILL scare the poop outta ya... I had the same experience at Fort Bragg. A line of junk "target" vehicles, a Starfighter coming on, full-afterburner and strafing the convoy with the 20mm... All happens in a second. THEN, all the sound after the plane is long gone! Then, just the eerie cackle of burning targets and tinkling of hundreds of fired cartridges raining down... Wild! Takes all the fun out of being a grunt... I imagine the new stuff is much MORE scary too! And, as ex-U.S Army, my hat's off to you! The French Foreign Legion Paratroopers are one rough bunch! Stay safe! Leo |
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Post by wilds on Nov 23, 2013 15:43:27 GMT -5
Oh boy. You, me and a couple of cases of beer. We'd be talking for days... |
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Post by oldchopperguy on Nov 24, 2013 1:54:48 GMT -5
A few years back I'd have said "better make it 3 cases..." But nowadays, 2 would do it! Stay safe my friend, Leo  |
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