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Post by oldchopperguy on Apr 3, 2017 20:28:20 GMT -5
Nope. The irony that Chinese scooters and bikes were labeled as hopeless a few years ago and now they be kicking butt in sales and showing how they can do the job as daily rides.
I always figured Chinese rides COULD be very good with only minor factory "tweaking". My first modern scooter was a new '07 Xingyue 150. It was BEAUTIFUL cosmetically, but had all the typical "Chinese bugs" including numerous cross-threaded nuts and bolts, coil and CDI going bad first season, starter disintegrating, rear disk-brake caliper "decomposing" inside, and more... Once I tracked down and repaired all the various quirks, it was easy and inexpensive to make "Lil' Bubba" a reliable ride with excellent performance for its displacement... The only reason I traded it in was to get a larger motor to keep up with local traffic getting faster and faster. At the factory, a Chinese manufacturer could have addressed all the mods I did, probably for under $100 total cost per-unit. That would have bumped my ride up to $700 from the $600 I paid. Even today, that would only be around a grand for a really nice 150. Not too shabby!I realize the modern REALLY good stuff like fuel-injection and high-tech emissions goodies add more and more to the cost, but I'll bet China could STILL offer a FIRST-CLASS 150 for $1,200 retail, and a solid dual-disk, liquid-cooled, fuel-injected high-end 300 or 350cc dual-purpose (city/highway-cruiser) that would putt-put around town, AND rip up to  -mph when needed, for $2,000 retail.
That stuff would sell mighty fast most anywhere!That's loosely what the Japanese did back in the 1960's and '70's when I was young, and we all know how popular THOSE rides made 2-wheel vehicles... "Naah... MY kid can't have a MOTORCYCLE! But he CAN have a HONDA..." Honda's ad agency made transportation HISTORY with the campaign "YOU MEET THE NICEST PEOPLE ON A HONDA." Suddenly, it was "acceptable" to ride, and Japanese rides were affordable, AND drop-dead reliable.
A large part of the world uses scooters for the family car... And, the Chinese may really score big with better scoots and bikes at REALLY affordable prices! If you build a better mousetrap, the cat gets a vacation... LOL! Ride safe one and all!Leo in Texas |
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Post by oldchopperguy on Apr 3, 2017 19:57:59 GMT -5
You're most welcome, my friend!
Ride safe!
Leo
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Post by oldchopperguy on Apr 3, 2017 19:56:37 GMT -5
That's cool. Kymco builds solid scooters and are the perfect sightseeing vehicle. Good for you.
Gotta agree! And that was a nice ride. I'm looking forward to putting a few enjoyable miles on my old Kymco soon... Back and forth to Wally World for cat-litter and prescriptions gets boring... LOL! As an old-school biker from fifty years back, it's great to realize that today's scooters can be as enjoyable as cruiser motorcycles on a nice day! And a WHOLE LOT cheaper to buy and maintain!Ride safe,Leo in Texas |
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Post by oldchopperguy on Apr 3, 2017 19:48:23 GMT -5
Spandi,
Yup, you got it! I'd forgotten about the Animals... Cool group! Have a bone on The Old Chopper Guy!
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Post by oldchopperguy on Apr 1, 2017 22:06:51 GMT -5
OK, I gotta admit I actually REMEMBER listening to BOTH groups on the Motorola "Golden Throat" radio in my 1950 Chevy... Seems the Troggs were a little more "guttural" and testosterone-oriented in their music, while the Turtles were more "saccharine-sweet" though not quite "Partridge Family"...
So I vote for the Troggs.
Back in the 1960's we were amazed at how the Brit guys could wear girlie haircuts, doofus suits with Nehru jackets and short pants, "Beatle boots" and STILL come off as masculine. Musta been a little James Bond DNA in 'em... LOL!
Besides, "Troggs" sounds a little "Stone-Age" or "Cave Man" and those dinosaur-thumpers were definitely "macho"... I wonder if they ever wore "Mullets"... HeHeHe...
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Post by oldchopperguy on Apr 1, 2017 21:35:26 GMT -5
Nice looking scoots, and impressive sales! Looks like 125 is a big (?) as they come though, and at nearly 2,000 British pounds, they are NOT cheap... Europe is SO different from America that it's hard to compare rides, or what they're used for. WAY back in the stone-age (1968-69) when I was in the Army serving in Germany, I learned that so well, and it's probably similar even today. It's good to see such quality showing up though. This company might have a good market here with some larger engines. Maybe it's just me, but I rode a Chinese 150 for seven years and I had it running as well as it was gonna get... good acceleration, and a top speed of around 62-mph. That is probably as good as a modern fuel-injected 125, but still mighty short on "giddyup"... Now, in my third season on "Minnie Mouse" I truly feel a strong-running 250 is the absolute BARE MINIMUM size scoot I'd trust to venture onto 50-mph speed limit surface streets, and it's "pushing the envelope" on 65-mph limited access highways. The old Mouse will top 75, but with a "realistic" cruise of only 65 up and down hills and into wind, that doesn't even begin to equal a safe highway experience. To avoid becoming road-kill on 70-mph limit highways, you MUST be able to cruise -mph+ up and down hills, into strong wind, etc. MINIMUM.
That performance level really takes it out of the realm of most of our scooters. It would take a 600-800cc (or bigger) ride with a CVT tranny to run comfortably at those speeds. While touring "scooters" do come with big motors, those which can run over 80-mph are really more "cruiser" motorcycles without clutch and gears...
But... If a 125 will meet your needs, these might just be winners!Ride safe, Leo in Texas
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No Way
by: oldchopperguy - Mar 30, 2017 18:34:25 GMT -5
Post by oldchopperguy on Mar 30, 2017 18:34:25 GMT -5
Old parking lot next to a prison. The instructors were former MotoCross Racers and shoveled sand in places and tore down fence rails and put them on one section of the course. Had a long way around with a slalom to make it more interesting since you had to a full turn around the course swerving around all the cones to get back to the starting line. The instructors can make it memorable and fun or a boaring drudge that you will soon forget. I feel I really got my monies worth.
An old parking lot next to a prison? How cool...In Texas, I can just see that scenario. The DOT could give the prisoners a rifle with one-round to shoot at the scooteristas taking the course... If they hit one, they'd get out of jail early... LOLOLOL!  Ok, OK... Only KIDDING... But not all that far-fetched... The "Easy Rider syndrome" is alive and well in the Lone Star State... After all, Texas IS the place of origin for the legal defense: "The dude jus' needed killin' "... |
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Post by oldchopperguy on Mar 30, 2017 18:24:49 GMT -5
I'm not sure about Italian scooter prices nationwide. Three seasons back, when I was looking for a 250 I found here in the Dallas/Fort Worth area clean USED Italian scoots were in the same price range as USED Japanese and Taiwanese models.
I did not look at new ones, so I don't know how they compared. I can envision getting a NEW one at clearance for not too much more than a Chinese counterpart, but you'd have to shop around. But, USED ones were incredibly affordable.
I think the geographic area, season and number of unsold units in-stock make MONUMENTAL differences in sales price. I'm sure prices may very by as much as 100% and bargains like Rockynv got are there. But you must really shop around!
I must note that Dallas is not a big scooter town. Many dealers have a glut of new, unsold rides at the end of the season. This can make a big difference.
Just what I found a few years back...
Leo in Texas
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Post by oldchopperguy on Mar 30, 2017 18:05:27 GMT -5
The Civic with the high performance VVT engine is available only with a manual tranny unless something changed recently. I love a manual tranny, but the Houston traffic will make wear out the clutch very often.
I think you are right. I saw some articles on that new Civic. It's supposed to be crazy fast! And only available with a manual tranny.
If my old knees would work, I'd have probably gone with that Accord coupe with the 6-speed manual. But then, if my knees worked I'd probably be riding a new Indian and wondering how to pay for it... LOLOLOL! Wow, that Accord first-gear is a neck-snapper! Love how it drove, but... the old left knee was no good after only a couple-mile test drive. For you younger guys/gals though, there are PLENTY of clean, used Honda Accord coupes with the V6 and 6-speed stick. Total luxury, scary top-speed AND incredible acceleration... I'd HIGHLY recommend them to anyone for an affordable screamer!
I don't think the clutch-wear would be a problem. They seem to be pretty "bullet-proof". I REALLY liked the smooth way that coupe clutch worked, along with a short-throw stick that just "snicks" from gear to gear... Boy, can you "stir the box" with THAT frisky little hamster! Just too heavy a clutch for my old knee... I figured by now that clutches would be hydraulic and require virtually no pressure to disengage. WRONG!
And I DO agree with you on that Houston traffic... It's truly AWFUL... like driving in Paris! (France) You'd have to throw the tranny into neutral a lot to keep from getting knees like mine... LOL!
Whatever you do, do NOT test-drive an Accord V6 with the 6-speed stick though (unless you're ready to pony-up a few grand)... Trust me, you will NOT want to leave without BUYING it... HeHeHe...
Dang, what a SWEET factory hotrod!Ride safe! Leo |
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Post by oldchopperguy on Mar 30, 2017 17:41:00 GMT -5
Unca Leo, you are STILL such a Wild Thing! You go get 'em, tiger! >'Kat
Kat, I'm afraid my Wild Thing days are pretty far in the past... Have a bone anyway! It's not hard to appear "wild" when the family grocery-getter will totally humiliate a "fast n' furious" tuner car without even turning off the AC... LOL! Now, the handbuilt scoot with the turbo-Accura V6 WAS a wild thing... Yup! 500+hp in a 400-pound scooter? THAT ride makes a Suzuki Hayabusa look tame!My new little Honda car is just one of those "pet" cars I'll probably keep forever (if she doesn't get stolen). With only 117K miles on her clock, and in near-new condition, I'm thinking if I live and keep driving until I'm 100, she'll only have around 150K miles on her. Time for her next timing belt replacement, but still just nicely broken in! I've always been a "made in America" car guy, but cheesh... These new Asian cars ARE mighty sweet! Ride safe,Leo |
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Post by oldchopperguy on Mar 29, 2017 20:36:35 GMT -5
Now all ya gotta do Leo is hop up Minnie Mouse and you'll have TWO "sleepers" LOL!
Hmmm... Let's see now... If I had another car, I could put the Honda V6 into the scooter. THAT would be an interesting ride! 300hp in a 350 pound scooter... SWEET! Might need some bigger brakes... Maybe?
Not actually too far fetched. A few years ago I ran into a Mexican kid on a totally hand-built scooter based on a pair of "L" shaped billet aluminum backbones. The workmanship was fabulous, and hanging from the backbone frame was a turbo-charged Acura V6... It used a chain-drive off a torque-converter so it remained a "twist-n'-go" scoot! I don't think "Minnie Mouse" has much future as a sleeper, other than her badging is hidden beneath the saddlebags, so most riders think she's a Chinese 150... I get a lot of comments on "How did you get that 150 to go 75?" THAT is sorta fun... LOL! I must admit that now, when weather is not good for riding, I enjoy driving the Honda as much as riding the scooter! Life is good... Ride safe!Leo |
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Post by oldchopperguy on Mar 29, 2017 20:19:10 GMT -5
Mikestib1,
You ARE my kind of guy... Have a bone! I'm 70, and have been riding for over 50 years. Now, arthritis keeps me from getting on and off the big bikes. So, 8 years ago I rediscovered scooters! Glad I did!
I'm incurably "old school" and put a retro spin on most any ride. I started with a Chinese 150 and learned more than I ever wanted to about fixing it... LOL! But, after working out all the Chinese bugs, I ended up with a reliable and fun little scoot.
A few years ago, our surface streets got totally redone, and local traffic began to run too fast for the 150, so I traded on a well-used 2007 Kymco Grandvista 250. I've been VERY happy with "Minnie Mouse". She's a small-wheel, short 250, very similar to many 150's so in-town riding is plenty nimble. But she'll still hit well over 70-mph so short runs on the freeway are possible.
I really don't miss the Harleys and other big bikes and am enjoying scooters. Modern scoots are LIGHTYEARS ahead of the old ones of my youth. In fact, to be brutally honest, my Taiwanese 250 is more enjoyable for overall riding than my old Harley baggers.
Ride safe!
Leo in Texas
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Post by oldchopperguy on Mar 28, 2017 21:46:38 GMT -5
Did you say your V6 Honda has a manual tranny? Awesome!
No, it was the VW that had the manual tranny... I first looked at a Honda Accord coupe with the V6 and 6-speed manual, but arthritis in my knees showed me I couldn't handle the heavy clutch, so I opted for the Accord 4-door with V6 and 5-speed automatic. If I could find a 4-door with the V6 and manual, it would be worth a LOT! They are RARE and bring obscene prices...
I must admit that now, I prefer the automatic... If you step on it hard from a dead stop, it absolutely "bounces your eyeballs off the back of your skull"... LOL! And, it shifts PERFECTLY right at the redline, giving a little rubber-burn with each shift. I had some fast cars in my youth (327, 350 and 396 Chevies mostly) and the best they'd do was 0-60 in 6-7 seconds, but topped out at less than 125-mph... Giving maybe 13 mpg at best. This Honda (with the AC running!) does 0-60 in 5.9 seconds by my stopwatch, and I don't even KNOW the top speed... On my trip to Houston, I took her to 140, with more left! Apparently the 160-mph speedo is not just for show! And, the new Michelin H-speed tires are rated for only 130-mph... THAT is more than fast enough for this old geezer!
And she's averaging 27 mpg all the time. How cars have CHANGED!  We would have gone NUTZ for a car like this when we were kids! |
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Post by oldchopperguy on Mar 28, 2017 17:35:34 GMT -5
OK, boyz n' gurlz...
THIS story is TOO funny not to share... Many of you know the missus and I got blessed by our daughter with the funds to buy a decent used car. I found one, and it's turned out to be SO much more than I planned on! 
The little Honda has been a REAL blessing to us, being in nearly "as-new" condition. The surprising part to me has been just how speedy she is... On a trip to Houston, I found she would go a LOT faster than I would drive. (Faster than her new H-rated Michelins are good for...) Around town, she exhibits acceleration WAY beyond what I'd expect, even with the frisky 3.0 V6... After all, 3 liters is only 180 cid, factory rated at a strong 247hp, but the seat of my pants tells me she feels more like 350+hp... So... a few days back, I made my pilgrimage to Wally-World for a bag of cat litter. At the first traffic light, a local tuner-kid stopped next to me in a really tricked-out VW Jetta... Mega-tires on premium rims, Brembo brakes, wild exhaust, monster tach and gauges and more...
The light turned green and for no particular reason, he nailed it HARD... The manual tranny smoking the tires for a few feet and then digging in. Just for fun, with him a car-length ahead, I hammered little "Rhonda" just to see how she'd stack up next to an obviously "fast n' furious" ride. Well, to my surprise, and the surprise of the tuner-kid I overtook and "slingshotted" past him with the gap between us lengthening up to WAY faster than I should have really gone... The street WAS clear of traffic, and no police in sight... LOL! Little Rhonda didn't just do the job, she humiliated the VW. Hmmm... WHAT goes on here?Next day, a neighbor kid came over asking if the Honda was mine. Yup! He said he was behind me when I left that light. He said that VW was "Pancho's" ride, and "pretty effin' fast". He then wanted to know WHAT I had under the hood... Cheesh, it's my GROCERY-GETTER, not street-racer.Since he seemed to be pretty hip to tuner cars, I had him look under the hood. He got really excited, and said: "Hey, Viejo, you know this mutha got a Type R motor?"OK, that makes it pretty frisky? Oh, yeah!I already knew the '04 seems to be mighty popular with the local kids, and Rhonda seems to have a little "extra" going for her. I researched the "Type R" mystique, and see it is a performance version of both the Civic and Accord. Rhonda is definitely not a factory Type R, and has no badging, no window-breaking exhaust... not even the "EX-L" badge... Only the simple V6 badge, and big (but near-silent) dual exhausts. She's quiet and smooth as an electric car. She gives great gas mileage... Not a hint of high-performance... UNTIL you get on her in first gear... Then, it's "Katy bar the door" and hang on"... Cheesh, just how much fun can a family sedan really be?Now, like the hapless young movie gunfighter, I've got an accidental "rep"... Local kids want to race for money... I've had to learn how to politely say "no thanks" in Spanish... LOL! I haven't indulged in street racing since 1965, on "Old Blue" when I gracefully retired the old chopper undefeated, after winning enough cash to pay the truly OBSCENE cost of building that Hog... LOL! Now, I'm 70-years old, just getting groceries and going to the doctors and find my family sedan is a real "sleeper"... Now THAT is a story I simply can't resist sharing with my "ItIsTheRide" pals... LOL!Enjoy the ride, whatever it may be!Leo in Texas
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No Way
by: oldchopperguy - Mar 28, 2017 16:50:50 GMT -5
Post by oldchopperguy on Mar 28, 2017 16:50:50 GMT -5
Yeah, what he said...  Yup! |
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-mph when needed, for $2,000 retail.
