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Post by oldchopperguy on Apr 27, 2018 22:02:35 GMT -5
Sorry to be a wet blanket Leo but I must respectively add a few points to this. The pressed steel design of the Vespa is not just a rolled, flat sheet of metal. It has numerous reinforcements internally that are tube like. While it may seem like a 300 Vespa is quick its 0-60 times hover around 13 to 15 seconds. A Honda Nighthawk 250, and the Rebel, post 12.2 second runs to the same speed. Never mind that 300cc bikes do it in six seconds. As for the 7K price tag. Feast your eyes on this. powersports.honda.com/2018/cb500x.aspxAdmittedly the Vespa is easier to mount but I know which I would want for a 500 mile day.
All good points. I need to qualify the post as to meeting my personal needs... That Honda is a fabulous bike for the money, but I'm now totally dedicated to step-through scoots. Arthritis, waning strength, etc. make it a real "chore" to climb on/off and ride a regular cycle, while a lightweight step-through scoot with CVT tranny is a pleasure.
I was really knocked out by the (felt) weight of the Vespa. Maybe an illusion with the heavy parts being very low, and the body (should be aluminum) being very light up top... but it just feels "right" to me... My Kymco weighs around 365 pounds, the Vespa specs say 340, so not all that much actual difference. But the Vespa actually FEELS like a Chinese 150 in my hands... So do some of the tall-wheel scoots too. Weight distribution must make a WORLD of difference! As for speed, the Vespa may not be all that much quicker to 60 than others, but I suspect it gets to 40-45 noticeably quicker. Riders also report being able to cruise at 75-80 which would be VERY good for a 300cc. I dunno, Vespas certainly are not for everybody, just like a Harley isn't for many but after spending several hours with one, I'm seeing why they have that "cult following"... You either love 'em or hate 'em... and think they're overpriced OR "expensive and worth every penny"...LOL! Until now, I felt they were vastly over-priced, but like 'em or not, they do provide a lot of scooter for the bucks... But they're only for those who want a high-end step-through ride. Not too many buyers other than old geezers like me, or ladies.
Now, the limited edition "Vespa RED" 300 at $10,500 really DOES carry a "jacked-up" price tag based on the buyer with extra bucks wanting something new, but "rare". Definitely for the country-club set (those with the Ferrari roadster and the Bentley sedan home in the 8-car garage...); not for regular scooter-jockeys like most of us on the forum...
My instincts tell me you're right about the Honda being better for 500 mile trips. But I have been fooled in this world of scooters... I put a half-century of happy miles on Harley baggers, but have to eat crow as my ancient Kymco is actually better for multi-hour rides than my old Hogs were! I NEVER would have thought that possible of a 250cc scooter...  I can ride the Grandvista for several hours with little fatigue, while my old Harley "Milwaukee Shakers" got downright painful along with numb wrists from the handlebars "buzzing" after an hour on the road.
For a practical Italian touring scoot, my dealer has a couple of new Piaggio BV 350's for around $3,400 out the door. Lots of scoot for the money! Admittedly more all-round useful at half the price of the Vespa but not a true flat-floor. I got on and off them and with my health issues, the Vespa still was a lot more "user friendly".
In a choice between the BV 350 and the Honda cycle, I think I'd actually prefer the Piaggio. But, that's what makes it a horserace! Neither Vespas OR Harleys are for everyone, but for those with a "Jones" for them, I do understand... It's neat that there are SO many choices today at all displacement sizes AND prices!
Add to that all the clean used rides and it could take a new rider YEARS to actually decide...For five seasons I've been mighty happy with the old Kymco, so I'm not hocking the family jewels any time soon for a Vespa... In a few years, when the 2018's sell for $2K or so, who knows? Probably everything will be electric by then anyway.Ride safe! Leo |
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Post by oldchopperguy on Apr 27, 2018 0:22:34 GMT -5
Well, boyz n' gurlz...
Tuesday, I took "Minnie Mouse" to my dealer and had the new Shinko 140/70-12 P-rated rear whitewall installed! John, the owner of Moxie Scooters was stuck working alone lacking his usual crew... So I did "floor duty" greeting customers and showing products... Doggone, THAT was actually fun! During the time, I learned a lot about the various scoots... Lance, Fly, Genuine, Stella, Kymco, SYM, and his new flagship line, VESPA.
I now have a vastly revised view of the pricey little spaghetti-burners...I found the new 300cc fuel-injected Vespas to be a LOT more special than I had expected. Yes, they cost a tad over $7K but close inspection reveals that might not be out of line at all. As I head (all to fast) past seventy, I find my strength and agility waning considerably. Light weight and easy handling are meaning more to me each year. The new Vespa uses the tried-and-true Vespa "monocoque" construction with no steel-tubing sub-frame. The body is it. Period. Nowadays it's made of aluminum and it is feather-light and super-stiff. No wobble, no flex, and you (or me, or a small lady) can lay a new 300 over on its side and pick it right back up like a bicycle... HHHMMMM... THIS gets INTERESTING!  Not only does this construction make the bike easy to manhandle, but makes it go like stink... These new 300's seem a tad bigger and more substantial than past models and sport 12" wheels. Brakes, suspension and all the running-gear are high-end goodies.   While many new 300's are heavier than my old Grandvista, and only a few mph faster... These Vespas are like rockets compared to most (except for the other Italian makes). But it seems to be the unibody aluminum construction that makes the real difference. Add to that the impeccable fit, finish and attention to detail and you pretty much have the "Ferrari" of scooters. The two pictured here are the touring and performance models, both paying cosmetic tribute to early Vespas of days gone by, with fender-mounted headlights, luggage racks, dual seats, etc. The touring version in brilliant gloss lacquer and the "Number 6" Sei Giorni" the same pale green but matte finish. The tourer features an irresistible solo-seat and passenger pillion, and both open together to expose the underseat pan. The luggage racks fore and aft fold neatly. The alloy wheels are TRUE mirror-polished and the entire package is simply first-class.
These scoots are high-quality, fast, nimble and easy to handle. And at $7,000 they equate to $700 in the 1950's... Just what a Vespa cost back then.I love my old Kymco and for me it's a good choice, but she's heavy, not all that quick and down the road, this lightweight and fast Vespa will look better and better... If it's in your budget, I would recommend one!
About the time I might want one of these, a used one should be affordable!My brief duty as salesman taught me a lot about the new scoots... AND, that many customers are more willing to shell out over $7K for the Vespa than $3,500 for something lesser. It all depends on one's budget I guess!
My advice is to NOT test-ride one of these unless you're prepared to pony-up for one, OR be a little disappointed in your present ride... LOL!  Leo in (finally riding on TWO factory whitewalls!) Texas
PS: Oh, and, YES... These Vespas run 120/40-12 tires up front, and 130/70-12 on the rear... SOOOO... You COULD put the Shinko whitewalls on them for a true fifties look... HeHeHe...
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Post by oldchopperguy on Apr 26, 2018 22:10:58 GMT -5
Gotta go with Taco Bell... Been around for a LONG time, pretty tasty stuff too.
How many of you are old enough to remember when Taco Bell tried to be more competitive with places like McDonalds with such taste treats as the "Bell Beefer" hamburger? That must have been around 1980... Stick with the nachos and tacos!
It's pretty macho just to have the cajones to market anything called a Bell Beefer... LOL!
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Post by oldchopperguy on Apr 25, 2018 19:45:20 GMT -5
He will be missed by patriotic Americans...
We could surely use some of his genre in the House, Senate and Congress RIGHT NOW!
Way TOO much "gray area" and TOO little ABSOLUTE right and wrong these days.
Rest in Peace, Gunny.
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Post by oldchopperguy on Apr 19, 2018 22:39:46 GMT -5
I stopped by my dealer yesterday, and couldn't help checking out his inventory of several Kymco Spade bikes... Doggone if they aren't appealing. Brings back fond memories of the Cushman Eagle and original Mustang of the fifties. Small enough that I could actually climb on one with arthritis that keeps me off Hogs and Indians... Took a quick ride and the little beast brought back fond memories of days long gone. It DOES combine some of the best features of a MOTORCYCLE and a SCOOTER all in one ride.  Nice little 150 motor with fuel injection, and the clutch n' gears tranny makes it friskier than the typical twist n' go scoot, but after nearly eight years on scooters now, I must admit I'm sold on the CVT tranny... Great for lazy old geezers like me. I'm spoiled!The only thing I did not truly love about the little Spade was that even though it's big enough for me to ride comfortably (I'm 6'1" and 225 pounds) I still felt sorta like "Hoss Cartwright" on a Shetland Pony... LOL! The cosmetics are compelling, the proportions do fit most sizes of riders, and overall they have a strong appeal. There really IS something to be said for a real tube-steel frame, gas-tank between yer' knees and REAL triple-trees on the fork... It IS a teensy real MOTORCYCLE... Aside from an "ample sized" old guy like me looking a tad "idiotic" on one, these little cycles are fun, great transportation and give great mileage. Pretty frisky too! Most anybody can ride them, and they are great for smaller riders and women who want a compact, non-intimidating bike. They may look a little "toy like" but when riding one, you KNOW you are on a REAL motorcycle. THAT says a lot... At the very least, a really enjoyable (though not exactly cheap) ride... Scores three thumbs up on the Old Chopper Guy's smile scale!Whether Kymco, or one of the other brands, for those who have enough play money for a second ride and want something really different and fun, try one out! Leo (felt like a kid again on the little wheezer) in Texas
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Post by oldchopperguy on Apr 19, 2018 0:35:03 GMT -5
Well, I guess it's time for SOMEONE to cast a vote... Maybe? 
I'll vote for the "plumber's crack"... At least plumbers are "sorta macho"... Crack cocaine is just plain bad news. Getting addicted to crack cocaine is no joke, and can ruin your life... On the other hand, if you find yourself getting addicted to " Plumber's Crack"... Well, THAT is something totally different... Not quite sure just WHERE you'd go for help on that one, but you'd definitely need help... Maybe Dr. Phil?   Unless your plumber is one of those lean and lanky, leggy, fashion-model type gal-plumbers like on the TV commercials, but it's not likely that those plumbers actually exist except in the minds of the guys who make the commercials... or those naughty fantasy phone lines... LOLOLOL!
Cheesh, I have enough trouble with those pesky cracks in the pavement... What THOSE gifts from the devil can do to a scoot is MORE than macho... LO not so L..... |
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Post by oldchopperguy on Apr 19, 2018 0:26:33 GMT -5
Right on. After looking at it I may keep most of the tail section from the burgman and fab it up to the 150. That way I keep all my mounting places and can keep custom work to a minimum. Still going to have to make a lot of bracing to keep it from twisting( I think). I did get it running so I can start taking it all apart as soon as I get time. I will take pics along the way Jjt, Sounds like a great plan for a VERY special custom build. And, judging by my experience with my first 150, you will likely need CONSIDERABLE bracing... LOL! Those light step-through frames ARE mighty "twisty"... But, racers stiffen them up with gussets and tubing and they work out fine. A little cutting and welding and you'll have a FABULOUS scoot! Have a bone! Leo in Texas |
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Post by oldchopperguy on Apr 19, 2018 0:18:04 GMT -5
Chewbaca,
Great call! Have a bone on the Old Chopper Guy!
After more than a half-century of riding, I'm STILL not used to liquid-cooled bikes... LOL! I wouldn't have thought about the temp gauge being out of whack...
With our 100-degree plus summers, I've thought about installing a "traditional" analog temp gauge on my Kymco 250 just as a "backup". "Minnie Mouse" (old '07 Grandvista) uses a digital dashboard that resembles something out of Darth Vader's bathroom... LOL! Very cool, but gimmie good old round, 1950's analog gauges with a pointer and numbers every time... Even twist them so the needles all point vertical when all is normal so any pointer NOT straight up and down gets noticed quickly.
I am NOT a fan of "bar graph" tachometers, temp gauges, etc. At least the old mouse has a digital speedo that reads actual NUMBERS... LOL!
This post reminds me of the value of having a quality, old-school temp gauge in the teensy radiator of our watercooled scoots just for safety. Not too hard to do and gives extra peace of mind. Come to think of it, I wouldn't mind a traditional old round analog tach too. I love my trouble-free scoot, but truly dislike those bar-graph gauges. Just me, but I'll bet there are others out there.
Keep the old teakettle from boiling, and ride safe!
Leo in Texas
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Post by oldchopperguy on Apr 15, 2018 23:19:49 GMT -5
What wheelbender6 said... Yup! Have a bone! Reminds me of the old story of the street-guys who got into a fight with straight-razors... One swings, the other says "you missed me!" The first guy replies "Oh yeah, wait 'till ya' try to turn yer' head..." Those swords are S-H-A-R-P... |
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Post by oldchopperguy on Apr 15, 2018 23:10:55 GMT -5
jjt,
Have a bone for this ambitious build...
Using the suspension and other parts from the donor bike sounds good, and, as the others have mentioned, you should address the frame too. My first scooter was a GY6 150 and it was fine "as-is". Later, I traded for my present Kymco 250. The old Grandvista is very similar to the Chinese 150's in size, proportion and wheelbase (a very small 250).
However, it is a full 100 pounds heavier. the frame is ENORMOUSLY stronger, stiffer and with thicker tubing. And it's only a 250.
I think the more safety-oriented parts from the donor bike you can salvage, the better off you will be.
Weld in gussets if needed, and keep it strong, stiff and "heavy duty"... The 150 step-through frame will likely be the weak spot. With the power, speed and brakes, it's a definite potential source of "wobble". Triangulating it with a brace to tie the frame together could be a real improvement. A few pounds of extra steel won't hurt... You'll still have the nimble size of the old 150 with real power!
Please do keep us posted with pix, and ride that beast safe!
Leo in Texas
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Post by oldchopperguy on Apr 13, 2018 22:13:11 GMT -5
... Leo (gettin' old enough to wobble walkin' the line sober...) in Texas 
Yeah, this getting old stuff is NOT for the young... Sometimes I get mixed up. The new Honda car is so quiet and smooth it almost "drives itself"... So when I drive the scoot, I tend to relax and when stopping at a red light forget to put my feet down.
Duh... Then I get a tippy-leany wakeup call... Hey, THIS car seldom falls over when I stop! Oh, wait! I'm on the SCOOTER! Now I remember... Foot OUT! No, the OTHER one... Nah, OOPS!... BOTH feet! Quick.Guess I'll have to switch the scoot's speedo over to KPH (neat feature if I move to China?)... Then when I'm running an indicated ninety in a fifty zone but not passing traffic, it'll remind me to check and see what I'm driving at the time... or something...? Wait a minute, the CAR also can switch from MPH to KPH too (in case I move to Japan?)... Now I feel like "Vinnie Barbarino"... "I'm so CONFUSED!"... LOL!
WHERE is Mr. Cotter when I really need him?Problems, problems... Now I find I'm wearing out the soles on my best boots on turns while removing the chicken strips from "Minnie Mouse's" tires... HeHeHe... Ride safe, and try to remember if you're on 2 wheels or 4...  Leo (have fun while yer' young enough to remember it) in Texas |
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Post by oldchopperguy on Apr 13, 2018 0:04:30 GMT -5
Hey, wheelbender6... Gotta say that Benelli TNT 135 is nearly "irresistible in its class. Doggone if those Italians don't have the knack even when the bike is made in China.
Thanks for posting! Have a bone!
I've always loved this type of min-cycle, from the venerable Cushman Eagle and original Mustang from the 1950's to the modern Grom, Kymco Spade, the new Mustang and many others. This one should really catch on... I give this one an extra "thumbs up" for using the 4-valve engine to employ REAL dual pipes!
With today's good suspension, brakes, frame geometry and forks, I can't help wondering if one of these miniature motorcycles powered by a 250-500cc engine (providing the little beast with 80+ mph speed) might not just explode the market. Suddenly it goes from strictly surface street transportation to something you could sneak onto the freeway, without giving up any compact nimble aspects. They're really not actually too small for highway speeds, just that the older versions lacked the handling and brakes for safety. Nowadays that is not an issue.
Who knows just where this new class of bikes will go?
They really ARE a new class of ride, and fit a new genre of transportation... Very versatile and very appealing!
Leo in Texas
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Post by oldchopperguy on Apr 12, 2018 23:35:29 GMT -5
Well, I don't suppose Johnny Cash could likely whoop a ninja, but for real "macho" he gets my vote...
There surely must be a Japanese word for ninjas that equates to "macho" (let's face it: like John Wayne toilet paper, they ARE rough and tough and don't take no crap off anybody) but the Asian warrior culture just is too far removed from the western world to fit the macho genre... Just me... (and apparently all the above voters... LOL!).
The "Man in Black" just OOZES macho when he steps onto the stage at Folsom Prison, and in that gravelly voice growls "Hello, I'm Johnny Cash" to screams and thunderous applause... Well... THAT is MACHO!
Leo (gettin' old enough to wobble walkin' the line sober...) in Texas
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Post by oldchopperguy on Apr 8, 2018 23:16:18 GMT -5
Close call... I'll go for the bridge though...
Takes a lot of macho engineering and workers to get the goodies across the gap to suspend the bridge from. Building neither one is for the faint of heart!
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Post by oldchopperguy on Apr 8, 2018 23:09:14 GMT -5
jjt,
Welcome to the forum! It IS great to get some "wind on your knuckles" after a long winter... New riding season starting, so ENJOY!
Ride safe,
Leo in Texas
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