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Post by dyoung1167 on Dec 4, 2017 16:05:20 GMT -5
cfmoto liquid cooled 150. got it to start yesterday after replacing the starter as the old one was burnt up. wouldn't run long and any throttle killed it. after running I noticed how hot the starter was even though I specifically did not over crank it, waiting between starts to try and keep from that exact thing. the guy I bought it from (who of course didn't say squat about it then) said he thought starter clutch wasn't disengaging but if the plug is out and I turn the motor by hand I really didn't think so. that was prior to getting it started. now i'm not so sure. would the starter still get hot without juice running through it, as in just getting turned by the motor? this is way different from a gy6 and not real enthused about trying to get to that thing, a damn load of varying screws and parts need to be taken out/off to do it. how bad would it be on the engine to try gumout engine flush (which I think is really just kerosene) and hope it dislodges the little roller pins and springs in the starter clutch? worth a shot or too damaging and should just bite the bullet and take it apart?
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Post by dyoung1167 on Dec 5, 2017 20:37:06 GMT -5
well , a lot of good this site is.
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Post by chewbaca on Dec 5, 2017 22:07:18 GMT -5
the starter is going to always get hot that's normal
if it is failing to disengage it will make a loud whine and then blow up as soon as you hit the gas so if you still have one...
sometimes the starter solenoid can stick causing the starter to run on
but its not hard to figure that one out as it will try to start even without the key on
sounds like you have a valve or fuel problem
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Post by cyborg55 on Dec 6, 2017 9:09:47 GMT -5
Engine flush won't do anything to help the starter issue,,,and as mentioned before if the starter is engaged all the time you'd know it
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Post by lostforawhile on Dec 8, 2017 18:33:27 GMT -5
The starter is hot because it's sitting on top of the engine next to a controlled gasoline fire, and it's made of metal
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Post by dyoung1167 on Dec 9, 2017 14:34:02 GMT -5
the engine did not run long enough for even it to get as warm as the starter got, and again, i did not over crank with it. and it's new
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Post by dyoung1167 on Dec 9, 2017 14:44:23 GMT -5
at the moment it will not go above idle and the exhaust isn't installed as I wasn't looking to run long, just wanting to see if it would run at all. while it did it also would die immediately upon any throttle advance so idle was it. that said it was obviously loud as especially being in a small storage shed.
I asked about the flush because i had a gy6 that the roller pins and springs were gummed up and not releasing the starter. It was of course a ton easier to get to and deal with directly. I take that back, sort of. it wasn't stuck engaged, the pins were stuck back, NOT engaging. gunk was not allowing the springs to do their job of keeping pressure on the pins, so they would not engage properly.
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Post by dyoung1167 on Dec 9, 2017 14:49:16 GMT -5
yeah, not the solenoid. before installing the new starter (and after actually) many attempts were made to start it but I know not to crank long and wait between tries to keep it cool and not once did it stick or try to run on when I let go of the start button.
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Post by dyoung1167 on Dec 9, 2017 15:03:31 GMT -5
is it possible some idiot before i got the scooter messed with wiring that could maybe keep the starter engaged if the engine is running? maybe crosswiring with the charging side of the r/r? meaning for me that as soon as the engine runs it keeps the solenoid engaged even though i have let off the button?
I guess I know the answer is sure it could be but....
because my own answer to anothers post for me was about gunk keeping the starter clutch engaged got me to thinking it would have to be some serious gunk to overcome the gearing and all involved with said clutch while the roller pins would only need to move a tiny bit to disengage.
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Post by chewbaca on Dec 9, 2017 17:28:59 GMT -5
the stock starter solenoid can get rusty and stuck its a common problem
however if you can turn the key off and the scooter is NOT still trying to start
then that's not the problem
as to improper wiring of the solenoid and starter motor ?
not very likely as it is extremely simple
battery power to a manual switch to a bigger battery powered electromechanical switch to the starter
often the break light is inline with the first switch as a safety
so you cant start the motor without at least one hand on the break
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Post by dyoung1167 on Dec 9, 2017 19:10:37 GMT -5
I guess I will set up a switch directly inline with the solenoid to see if my thought on the wiring (vs taking all kinds of crap apart to visually see a wiring error) and just shut it off as soon as it starts. It will all come off eventually for painting but right now good running order comes first.
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Post by chewbaca on Dec 9, 2017 19:21:27 GMT -5
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Post by dyoung1167 on Dec 9, 2017 19:50:10 GMT -5
yarr, I have my meter and could very well do that. I've only been an electrician for going on 30 yrs. duh to me, haha.
now you mention it, since the starter would actually become a generator I could get a reading on both ends of this problem. Any voltage on the starter lead after running will at least confirm if it is spinning.
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Post by lostforawhile on Dec 9, 2017 22:44:00 GMT -5
if the clutch is sticking, just get another, they are cheap, it should be similar to a 50, pull the cover, and remove the variator, and it should pop right out, the starter is nothing but an electric motor. attached to the clutch assembly.
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Post by dyoung1167 on Dec 12, 2017 13:40:20 GMT -5
nothing even close to a 50 style starter clutch unfortunately, else it would have been tackled easily, even a normal 150 is relatively easy compared to this water cooled engine. In the end it may turn out easier than I think but it is definitely much much more involved.
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