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Post by geh3333 on May 21, 2015 0:53:49 GMT -5
Hey lain , do u have a flywheel puller ? If not , you can use a steering wheel puller . that's what I have to do. I have a flywheel puller yes. I screwed my flywheel puller up. I accidentally left the washer on the shaft and the darn puller stripped ! |
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Post by tvnacman on May 21, 2015 4:30:09 GMT -5
Lain, what stator is in the stock engine? (number of wires and colors) Then the same for the replacement engine? Does your scooter have a kill switch?
John
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Post by phatboy on May 22, 2015 1:22:02 GMT -5
Honestly, I would convert the scooter to AC. I had a scooter with a DC CDI and if the battery got low enough, you could not even kick start it to get home. I had to get a jump start for my scoot which just seems wrong if it has a kick starter! I am pretty sure the AC CDIs don't have that problem.
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Post by geh3333 on May 22, 2015 1:32:42 GMT -5
Honestly, I would convert the scooter to AC. I had a scooter with a DC CDI and if the battery got low enough, you could not even kick start it to get home. I had to get a jump start for my scoot which just seems wrong if it has a kick starter! I am pretty sure the AC CDIs don't have that problem. You are correct. If the battery dies on the DC scoot , we'll your stuck! But the cdi is powered from the stator and the kick start should always work. |
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Post by RapidJim on May 22, 2015 8:26:33 GMT -5
AC vrs DC stators.The name is confusing to some, it does not refer to the power coming out of the stator, it refers to the type of CDI system you have. There is also several TYPES of stators besides coil count, type one and type two ect. This normally refers to the number of wires, plug configuration and floating or non floating ground.
All stators produce AC voltage and current no matter what the name implies. To get DC to charge the battery, the stator is wired to a regulator ( rectifier ) which changes the AC voltage from the stator to DC and also regulates it to a fixed voltage of around 13VDC. The yellow and white wires from a 8 pole stator are your charging and lighting wires. These wires are run to the regulator, most larger stators 11 coil and up use 3 yellow wires and all called 3 phase but operate the same, just more power and a differently wired larger regulator. Now the 2 wires that are left, normally red with a black tracer and blue with a yellow tracer are dedicated to powering and triggering the CDI. The blue with yellow is the trigger to the CDI and "tells' the CDI when to fire the coil. The above is the same no matter if you have a DC or AC powered CDI.
Now the only way to be sure what type of CDI you have is to look at the wiring configuration. Years ago, if your headlights came on with the key it was assumed you had a DC CDI, also physical size told the same story, this is no longer the case. Your standard GY6 CDI will have two plugs on it, one 4 pin plug and 1 two pin plug. The 2 pin plug will tell you the CDI type. If it has 2 wires in that plug then it is AC if it has only one then it is DC.
AC CDI: The red wire with the black tracer coming from the stator is what powers an AC CDI, the other wire in that plug is your kill switch circuit, normally black with a white tracer. The stator has one dedicated coil that that wire is connected too.
DC CDI: The red wire with the black tracer from the stator is not used. Instead, the single wire in the two pin connecter of the CDI gets it's 12 volt power from the key switch. The kill switch circuit removes this 12 volts.
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Post by lain on May 22, 2015 8:55:53 GMT -5
Well, changing and rewiring everything for AC is not in the budget, we would also need to buy a rectifier, ac cdi, some wiring, terminal ends, etc you get the point. Already spent everything he had to get the engine. I'm not paying for someone elses scooter, I am just helping my friend get it back on the road so the simplest and fastest method is the best right now. Also he has a new battery and a spare battery, he knows about the issue with dead batteries and not being able to kick it.
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Post by lain on May 22, 2015 11:43:06 GMT -5
So I'm over at my friends now. There are 5 wires coming from the ac stator, and 5 wires coming from the dc stator. The Dc stator has 3 orange wires, a green, and a blue/white. The Ac stator has a white, yellow, green, red/black and blue/white. Looks similar enough to just change the wire ends and stick the wires in the right places.
Would this be the correct way to wire the AC labeled one to the DC harness? White, yellow and red/black to the orange wires, green to green, and blue/white to blue/white?
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Post by dmartin95 on May 22, 2015 12:01:45 GMT -5
So I'm over at my friends now. There are 5 wires coming from the ac stator, and 5 wires coming from the dc stator. The Dc stator has 3 orange wires, a green, and a blue/white. The Ac stator has a white, yellow, green, red/black and blue/white. Looks similar enough to just change the wire ends and stick the wires in the right places. Would this be the correct way to wire the AC labeled one to the DC harness? White, yellow and red/black to the orange wires, green to green, and blue/white to blue/white? Absolutely not. Your friend likely has a 3 phase, 12 pole stator based on the wiring you describe... The three orange are all A/C out, green is ground blue/white is your pick up.... An A/C single phase (even if it's floating ground won't work) stator will not work with his R/R. The wires for your A/C stator are this: White/Yellow A/C output (even though they're both A/C, this is single phase/half wave and not 2 phase - If it has a floating ground then it's 2 phase/full wave) Green is ground Red with black stripe is for the A/C CDI (This is your firing coil) Blue with white stripe runs to your CDI (this is your pick up) If you had an 11 pole, three phase A/C stator that would work with his R/R but you're out of luck in this case. |
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Post by lain on May 22, 2015 12:47:11 GMT -5
So I'm over at my friends now. There are 5 wires coming from the ac stator, and 5 wires coming from the dc stator. The Dc stator has 3 orange wires, a green, and a blue/white. The Ac stator has a white, yellow, green, red/black and blue/white. Looks similar enough to just change the wire ends and stick the wires in the right places. Would this be the correct way to wire the AC labeled one to the DC harness? White, yellow and red/black to the orange wires, green to green, and blue/white to blue/white? Absolutely not. Your friend likely has a 3 phase, 12 pole stator based on the wiring you describe... The three orange are all A/C out, green is ground blue/whit is your pick up.... An A/C single phase (even if it's floating ground won't work) stator will not work with his R/R. The wires for your A/C stator are this: White/Yellow A/C output (even though there both A/C, this is single phase/half wave and not 2 phase - If it has a floating ground then it's 2 phase/full wave) Green is ground Red with black stripe is for the A/C CDI (This is your firing coil) Blue with white stripe runs to your CDI (this is your pick up) If you had an 11 pole, three phase A/C stator that would work with his R/R but you're out of luck in this case. Darn, well the only thing stopping us from using the stator from the old engine is the flywheel. I thought I had the right puller but I do not. How do I get this thing off without a puller? Or is there something very similar to a puller I can buy locally at autozone or something? We tried wedging flatheads under the sides of the flywheel and trying to push it out while tapping the flywheel gently, but no luck. Tried pulling it with all of our might just because we're guys, no luck. Tried staring at it for a while too, but we couldn't scare it off... |
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Post by dmartin95 on May 22, 2015 14:58:31 GMT -5
Absolutely not. Your friend likely has a 3 phase, 12 pole stator based on the wiring you describe... The three orange are all A/C out, green is ground blue/whit is your pick up.... An A/C single phase (even if it's floating ground won't work) stator will not work with his R/R. The wires for your A/C stator are this: White/Yellow A/C output (even though there both A/C, this is single phase/half wave and not 2 phase - If it has a floating ground then it's 2 phase/full wave) Green is ground Red with black stripe is for the A/C CDI (This is your firing coil) Blue with white stripe runs to your CDI (this is your pick up) If you had an 11 pole, three phase A/C stator that would work with his R/R but you're out of luck in this case. Darn, well the only thing stopping us from using the stator from the old engine is the flywheel. I thought I had the right puller but I do not. How do I get this thing off without a puller? Or is there something very similar to a puller I can buy locally at autozone or something? We tried wedging flatheads under the sides of the flywheel and trying to push it out while tapping the flywheel gently, but no luck. Tried pulling it with all of our might just because we're guys, no luck. Tried staring at it for a while too, but we couldn't scare it off... Not that I am aware of I'd be cautious about trying alternative methods... You may screw something up and make the problem worst... MY advice is this bud, exercise a little patience.... John (TVNacman) has these things in stock and can get ya one out in no time.... They're cheap. |
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Post by geh3333 on May 22, 2015 23:20:11 GMT -5
Absolutely not. Your friend likely has a 3 phase, 12 pole stator based on the wiring you describe... The three orange are all A/C out, green is ground blue/whit is your pick up.... An A/C single phase (even if it's floating ground won't work) stator will not work with his R/R. The wires for your A/C stator are this: White/Yellow A/C output (even though there both A/C, this is single phase/half wave and not 2 phase - If it has a floating ground then it's 2 phase/full wave) Green is ground Red with black stripe is for the A/C CDI (This is your firing coil) Blue with white stripe runs to your CDI (this is your pick up) If you had an 11 pole, three phase A/C stator that would work with his R/R but you're out of luck in this case. Darn, well the only thing stopping us from using the stator from the old engine is the flywheel. I thought I had the right puller but I do not. How do I get this thing off without a puller? Or is there something very similar to a puller I can buy locally at autozone or something? We tried wedging flatheads under the sides of the flywheel and trying to push it out while tapping the flywheel gently, but no luck. Tried pulling it with all of our might just because we're guys, no luck. Tried staring at it for a while too, but we couldn't scare it off... Hey lain , I have an 11 pole stator and it should be for a DC scoot. If u want it its yours . pretty much brand new . I got it from a member who bout a new engine from scrappy and it would not work on his setup. I was eventually going to use it , but if you can I'd be glad to give it to you. |
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Post by lain on May 22, 2015 23:24:37 GMT -5
Darn, well the only thing stopping us from using the stator from the old engine is the flywheel. I thought I had the right puller but I do not. How do I get this thing off without a puller? Or is there something very similar to a puller I can buy locally at autozone or something? We tried wedging flatheads under the sides of the flywheel and trying to push it out while tapping the flywheel gently, but no luck. Tried pulling it with all of our might just because we're guys, no luck. Tried staring at it for a while too, but we couldn't scare it off... Hey lain , I have an 11 pole stator and it should be for a DC scoot. If u want it its yours . pretty much brand new . I got it from a member who bout a new engine from scrappy and it would not work on his setup. I was eventually going to use it , but if you can I'd be glad to give it to you. I don't think there is a need at the moment. Last known the old engine's stator was good. I ordered a flywheel puller for 150cc engines, 27mm size, so we should have it off next week. Until then just going to install everything else. Is it possible to run a DC scoot without the stator hooked up, just the pickup? Just wondering in case I can do that to tune the new carb to save some time. |
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Post by geh3333 on May 22, 2015 23:25:25 GMT -5
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Post by geh3333 on May 22, 2015 23:29:16 GMT -5
I use a couple 5/16 bolts from the scoot and screw them into the flywheel , then I leave the flywheel nut screwwed on slightly, so the center bolt on the puller sits in the nut , so it doesn't slip off the center shaft.
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Post by geh3333 on May 22, 2015 23:35:13 GMT -5
You can even put a few spot welds on the flywheel puller . welding it to the flywheel . then just cut the spot welds off.
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