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Post by w650 on Oct 1, 2017 19:24:57 GMT -5
I can't imagine that Honda didn't stress test the engine both on a dyno and a computer simulation. Of course as we all know, the more gadgets, the more chances for failure. It's why all my stuff is carbureted.
Honda uses DCT in cars. I would imagine they know how to instill durability.
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Post by w650 on Sept 28, 2017 9:43:55 GMT -5
At $8299.00 it's less than a 650 Burgy and not far off a Vespa 300. Slap bags and a shield on it and it's a do all machine.
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Post by w650 on Sept 25, 2017 13:38:42 GMT -5
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Post by w650 on Sept 25, 2017 13:13:18 GMT -5
Been there. My Fashion is on a maintainer too. The charger said all was good but when I tried to start it the battery died after a few cranks. A new battery solved the problem.
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Post by w650 on Aug 25, 2017 20:28:20 GMT -5
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Post by w650 on Aug 24, 2017 11:37:17 GMT -5
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Post by w650 on Aug 23, 2017 14:12:46 GMT -5
Being held prisoner in Area 51 Tom.
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Post by w650 on Aug 23, 2017 10:26:05 GMT -5
Hmmm. No problems. Here's one of my Modern Vespa favorites. Guy was cruising when the motor quit. Not running WFO. Yes, I had tio look it up, but I had seen it revived a few times. modernvespa.com/forum/topic130381.2?highlight=valve+breakSee how many others chime in with stories of blown motors. Yes, you can go on once in a while but by and large there's something....like this from today. modernvespa.com/forum/topic155819Here's why this happens Matt. I'll tell you because you will listen. Over the years, until MV Augusta began production, most Italian bikes were one or two cylinders. Given that, weight was a major issue. They were nuts about weight. Wiring and connectors were as thin as they could make them, engine components and gear box components were exotic and hardened to an inch of their lives but as small as could be made. They also use exotic materials that saved weight. BUT. Reliability suffered at the hands of owners who treated them like Japanese motorcycles. They also didn't last anyway. In the 70s Moto Guzzi owners had to replace broken shift return springs annually. This meant full engine removal and disassembling the gear box. In pursuit of light weight Guzzis had chrome bore lining instead of iron liners. It worked great, was light and lasted to about 50,000 when it wore through to the aluminum it was bonded to. Historically Italian bikes have always been the Sunday bike while another Japanese or German bike was the daily driver. Remember the Cook Neilson/Phil Schilling California Hot Rod was described by Neilson like this. "The only part on the bike that's still Ducati is the engine cases. By the time we got done everything else came from outside." Let me put this out there because I checked. The Vespa 300 weighs in at about 340 pounds. The Piaggio BV 350 at 315cc weighs in at 390. Do you think the BV's frame weighs 50 pounds more than the Vespa's? Scrupulous mechanics can drag an Italian scooter up to around 75,000 miles. An exceptional one can get 100,000 or more. Joe Average citizen will pay many times the original purchase price in dealer maintenance. Those light weight components will break and fail without proper supervision. Judy in Hawaii stated she's paid enough to buy a fleet of Sprints to get to 44,000 miles. There's a reason Japanese and BMW scooters are so much heavier and it isn't cost cutting at the factory. It's for longevity. |
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Post by w650 on Aug 22, 2017 16:11:19 GMT -5
One has to wonder what would happen to scooters in America with the demise of 50cc models. Electric scooters might be practical but lack the visceral feel of a gas engine. The 50cc scooter is a gateway to larger rides, their extinction might disrupt any growth in scooters.
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Post by w650 on Aug 18, 2017 14:21:55 GMT -5
Good choice. The Sportster engine has a history tracing back to the 1950s. It uses geared drive for the cams and is called "the best engine Harley ever made" by some. The new rubber mounted, all aluminum engine can last darn near forever.
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Post by w650 on Aug 18, 2017 8:55:03 GMT -5
For those sitting in the bleachers observing this, let me explain. I've been street riding since 1973. Before that I did dirt riding for eleven years. I've seen a lot. I've heard a lot. Italian bikes have always had the Mystique of Harley Davidsons with many of the faults. I could string together anecdotal evidence of their flaws. They started out with the same footing as the Japanese back in 1961. A war torn country with cheap bikes to sell here. Even Sears used them. Today the Italians build "Niche" motorcycles while the Japanese build millions of them.
Hearing words like "The Italians are the Gold Standard of metal" raises the hair on the back of my neck. Rocky is entitled to his opinion but history tells otherwise.
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Post by w650 on Aug 18, 2017 5:04:28 GMT -5
Okay. From now on every time I read about theongoing failures of metal and electronics on Vespas I'll post them here for you to explain Rocky. Starting with this. modernvespa.com/forum/topic155585The fuel pump problem went on for years...Oh, and how about those Aprilia V-4 connecting rods? What was it? Bad shot peening? My favorite. modernvespa.com/forum/topic149368?highlight=electrical+connectionsT he problem you have reported is not UN common and has been documented on here a few times in the past,
The cables connect directly to the voltage regulator which WILL fail at some point as this part is also well known as a weak link on the GTS
Do I go on? As for your maintenance schedules Rocky, your own words give you away. "The failures were because the owners didn't follow their maintenance schedules "By The Book". "Tires should be thrown away every three years" "It wasn't the bike's fault. The mechanics were uneducated" I'm not smoking anything. I just read...and listen. |
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Post by w650 on Aug 17, 2017 14:15:51 GMT -5
Two things Kat. First, if I heard right, the BV 200 was built in China and like all Chinese built Piaggios didn't suffer fluky problems. Second, not all Vespas are finicky, some last forever with minimal intervention. BUT, and this has been a problem with Italian motorcycles forever. Overly technical specs requiring intense maintenance and poor quality control. The people who love them overlook that for the Mystique.
Desmodromic valves? Really
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Post by w650 on Aug 16, 2017 16:46:40 GMT -5
I don't doubt some of the problems are self inflicted but many issues are repetitive and not due to owner abuse. You don't have to peruse Modern Vespa long to see how devoted the owners are. They accept the issues to be part of the continuum. Still they don't shy away from documenting some of the engineering and electrical let downs. I appreciate their honesty.
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Post by w650 on Aug 16, 2017 5:36:52 GMT -5
Thank you for proving my point. What you described above is NASA resources an Aprilia requires just to stay on the road for a brief Sunday ride. It is the Hallmark of Italian failures over the decades. Massive fiddling just to be used.
Perfect example. Ducati. For years the darling of the motoring press but scourge of the general public. Constant electric and mechanical failures from their exotic use of tech and materials. Then Volkswagen bought them, introduced common sense and real quality control. Now Ducati sales are rocketing and the bikes are more durable.
You may enjoy spending as much time maintaining as riding your Aprilia but at the end of the day a Honda Forza is a better choice for a daily driver, heck maybe even a Citicom 300i. It's why the Japanese rule as everyday bikes.
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