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Post by william42 on Apr 12, 2014 9:41:57 GMT -5
I'm going to start a new thread on my scooter problem because it won't let me reply to my original one here itistheride.boards.net/thread/5668.
I am of the opinion that I have a fuel delivery problem and that my float bowl isn't being kept full. I made a video of my research to the problem. What do you think?
Now I don't know how to test the fuel pump but by blowing in the inlet port I get free flowing air in both directions. By blowing and sucking on the vacuum port I can feel the diaphram tightening in both directions. That is, I don't think it's ripped.
I might add that my fuel tank is below the carburetor so the fuel pump has to pump fuel up to the carb. By the video were do y'all think the problem lies?
Thanks in advance for any input.
Bill
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Post by tvnacman on Apr 12, 2014 10:02:42 GMT -5
cranking vac and running vac is different . the fuel pump is a pulse pump . Put the carb back in , fill the fuel line to the carb with fuel (to prime it) connect it to the carb . Get an extra vac hose , pull the main system vac hose put it to the side , slide the extra hose on the main port crank the engine and let the extra hose suck an ounce or two of fuel the moment it starts , pull the extra hose and get the system hose back on before it stalls . I have had to cover the hose hole after it sucked in gas to get it to start .
John
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Post by alleyoop on Apr 12, 2014 13:23:43 GMT -5
If it was running find before I would agree the PUMP is bad OR it is not creating enough Vacuum. Have you adjusted the Valves? If the valves are not sealing it will not create enough vacuum.
Alleyoop
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Post by william42 on Apr 12, 2014 15:47:24 GMT -5
I adjusted the valves last night after I read your response on the other thread alleyoop. After I did that it started up and ran GREAT! Then I took it for a ride and got stranded 3 miles from home and it wouldn't start up again for two hours.
This morning it started great again and after running it for about a minute I drained the float bowl just to see how much gas was in it and it didn't seem like very much. Maybe an ounce or so, if that.
After putting the carb and fuel pump back in I rerouted the vacuum lines so they would be straighter and run more direct to their respective ports. In other words, I shortened the two of them. I also replaced the fuel line from the pump to the carb.
Now when I start it I have to keep it at half throttle or it'll die. I either did something wrong or the problem got worse on it's own. Grrr...
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Post by alleyoop on Apr 12, 2014 16:10:02 GMT -5
Now it sounds like you have a leak if it was running better before. Take a pic of the hoses going from the carb area to the fuel pump.
Alleyoop
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Post by william42 on Apr 12, 2014 23:30:54 GMT -5
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Post by alleyoop on Apr 12, 2014 23:54:08 GMT -5
WOW!! what is all that curved vacuum hose going to the fuel pump, here i Drew a yellow line how I would make the connection to get as much vacuum to the PUMP and to the carbs ACV valve. See the YELLOW that is where I would put the "Y" connector, then the blue lines are your vacuum hoses SHORT and sweet. Alleyoop  |
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Post by william42 on Apr 13, 2014 7:26:43 GMT -5
I put the loop in the hose because there is only so much room to run the vacuum lines and any other way they threatened to kink on me.
I pulled the plug last night and it looked ok to me and it also had plenty of spark. With the plug out I put my finger over the plug hole and hit the starter. I had plenty compression and suction so I should have plenty of vacuum in the lines.
The plate riveted to the frame says the valve clearance should be .006-.008 so I reset them to .007. Then I put it away for the night.
I just went out there and it started right off and ran for .5 seconds. (a half a second). It won't keep running for nothing. It tries to run but won't. The third time I tried to start it the starter was the only thing going. Nothing else.
So, I have spark, I have fuel in the float bowl (because I just drained it to see), and I have good compression (so I assume good airflow). Yet now it doesn't even start. What am I missing here? I had intermitent problems that slowly got worse, then it failed altogether. ?
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Post by william42 on Apr 13, 2014 10:32:14 GMT -5
If I have bubbles coming out from around the intake valve during compression does that mean the cylinder is flooded with gas?
I still have good spark and compression so I removed the spark plug to air out the cylinder and see if that helps. Maybe it's flooded so that's why it won't start???
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Post by tvnacman on Apr 13, 2014 11:24:34 GMT -5
If I have bubbles coming out from around the intake valve during compression does that mean the cylinder is flooded with gas? I still have good spark and compression so I removed the spark plug to air out the cylinder and see if that helps. Maybe it's flooded so that's why it won't start??? That shows the valve is not sealing , remove the head and lap the valves then recheck . John |
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Post by william42 on Apr 13, 2014 12:08:28 GMT -5
What kind of problems will a tiny seal breach in the intake valve cause? I mean, the compression is great enough that it forces my finger off the spark plug hole. There may be some back pressure through that valve and back into the carburetor but it's minimal. Is that tiny bit of pressusre leak back to the carb going to be causing the kind of problems that I'm having? I'd like to take care of the this problem first. Is this the root cause of my problem?
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Post by william42 on Apr 13, 2014 13:22:38 GMT -5
Ok, so after I aired out the cylinder I got it started again. It took awhile but I stayed off the throttle and she finally caught and stayed running. I let it warm up good then drove it up and down the block without any trouble. So I'm thinking that it was just flooded. But that doesn't explain my initial problem of it just stalling on me when I'm doing 45mph. I just don't get it!  |
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Post by alleyoop on Apr 13, 2014 13:31:32 GMT -5
At higher rpms the motors create less Vacuum and the motor is using more more gas. I hate to repeat myself but the way you have the vacuum lines setup is not good and will effect the amount of vacuum applied to the pump and I think the carb bowl is not filling up fast enough to keep up with the demand and it dies for lack of fuel.
my .02
Alleyoop
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Post by william42 on Apr 13, 2014 19:22:46 GMT -5
Here's the flowchart:
Always started hard from day 1, that is, it would start but I had to play with the throttle to keep it running until it warmed up and even then it would die at the first stop sign. I increased the idle speed.
1st tank of gas; had no problems. (other than the warm up period listed above)
2nd tank of gas, problem started almost right away.
1st problem ; was driving at 45 mph, (for about 3 miles) engine lost all power, slowed to 30 then caught again and went back up to 45 and finished the trip home.
2nd problem; Same as first problem.
3rd problem; Same as original problem except the engine never caught and I came to a complete stop. But it started right back up and I finished the trip home.
4th problem. Same as 3rd problem except it took longer to start this time (about 5 minutes)
Then I posted my problem and ended up adjusting the valves to .004. It started up and idled better than it ever has so I took it out for a spin. About 3 miles down the road it lost power again and I couldn't get it started again for two hours.
I rerouted the vacuum lines, adjusted the valves to .007, emptied then replaced gas that was left in tank (maybe I just got bad gas?)
I just went out and hit the starter on a 6 hour cold engine and it popped off instantly and idled ok. I could tell the Enricher was working by the way the idle was going up and down slightly. It never did that when I first got it. I can hear the valves ticking now but I remember what an old timer once said to me. "Better to hear the valves than have them too tight". And they're set to factory recommended specs.
I guess now all I can do is try it out and see what happens...
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Post by tvnacman on Apr 13, 2014 19:53:20 GMT -5
The .007 is that inch or mm ? Alley might be on to something it does sound like it is starving for fuel most of your numbered questions are top end problems and you have decent restart . Have you gone over all your grounds (take them apart clean and reassemble ) ? Adding an extra few grounds won't hurt if I'm incorrect on a fuel problem then I would look at electric .
John
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..BAD TO THE BONE..
